Hey, good afternoon. Welcome to the 4Q FY26 earnings call of Thermax Limited.

We have the management today, Mr. Rajendran, the group CFO and executive vice president.

Over to you, sir, for the opening remarks, post which we can pick up the Q&A. Thank you.

Thank you, Kunal. Good morning to all of you, for those who have joined the call.

Upfront, would want to inform you that Ashish Bhandari, our Managing Director and CEO, normally heads this call. He is on travel and is unable to join this call.

I would be taking this up today. Would be happy to answer your queries.

Broadly talking about Q4, I think we came good on our plans for revenue, execution of jobs, and recognizing revenue this quarter better than the prior quarters. Profitability was per plans for us.

The order book number, I think as you must have seen and as per an earlier disclosure we had done, we booked an supercritical job for about roughly ₹1,600 crore. That has increased our order book number for the quarter.

However, excluding that as well, our order book for the quarter has been reasonably robust. I think on overall other performance parameters and the cash balance, I think you must have seen in investor presentation, we are fairly better off than the prior period.

I'll keep that comments brief and would now take any questions that you may have on the Q4 numbers.

Hi, sir. Very good morning.

Thanks a lot for taking this call, and congrats on a good set of numbers, especially the order inflow. My first question is in terms of the enquiry pipeline for the traditional sectors that generally gives you the orders, including steel, cement, power, and oil and gas.

How is the momentum there in terms of enquiries and pipeline of orders? That's the first question.

Okay.

Ravi, I think thanks for that. The general order book outlook both from our domestic perspective as well as on our international front is reasonably fair, reasonably robust.

We are seeing a good pipeline on the sectors that you mentioned. Some on the projects for our industrial infra business, as well as for our industrial products business where there are other sectors like pharma, chemicals, FMCG that we focus upon.

I think the order pipeline and outlook for our heating, water treatment, air pollution control businesses are also reasonably there at this point of time. We feel confident of how the working platform looks on our order fronts now at this time.

However, a point to note would be the impact of war prolonging and any other further impacts that could be having across various industries both domestically and internationally. If that was to develop more on that front, then I think we believe that there could be some impact going ahead in Q2, Q3, which we will have to watch out for.

I think that's the cautious part that we have to be on the outlook front.

Are there any pipeline of large orders from the power and steel side just like how we had got this quarter, something similar, can it pan out in the next 12 to 24 months?

There are quite a few on the refinery side and others that we are working upon, but I think there's one which we are reasonably confident of having a win, which is on the data center side. That's more on the energy front for our industrial infra business.

This is for an supply of boilers to a steam turbine-based solutions for a data center opportunity in the global market. We're looking at that closely, and we're hoping that we will be able to conclude that.

We'll see whether that comes in in quarter one.

Sure, sir. With respect to data centers, just double-clicking on the kind of opportunity that is there, what would be the addressable market in India and outside India, especially the US, that we can end up catering to?

Is there any market size for it for the chillers and possible boiler supplies also? Okay.

I think,

Ravi, I'll take this as your last question and so that we can come back on other questions as well from others. Answering this particular one on the data center opportunity is, I think, the first one which we informed you was of the cooling opportunity that we had both in the international market and the domestic one, the orders that we booked in the quarter three.

Our outlook on that cooling opportunity remains robust for us at this time. However, we haven't yet quantified the way that I think you would be looking for in terms of market opportunity, target market share, etc., which we would going ahead be able to do it for you.

At this time, I think we have no numbers to share on that front. On the other part of this data center opportunity is the boiler-side opportunity that has come by.

That's an interesting other solution opening for us in terms of revenues. That's a good part that we see on that opportunity.

Got it, sir. Thanks a lot.

Thank you.

Good morning, sir. Thanks for the opportunity.

My first question is on the data center, sir. What is the capacity of the data center for which you are supplying your cooling solutions?

Is it possible to share that number in MW?

Mohit, I think I can get back to you on that. I don't have it offhand.

We will share that with you separately.

Understood. My second question is, sir, on the green solutions.

In this quarter, I think we have the losses in the quarter. Can you just explain what led to the losses and what is the MW which has got commissioned by the end of FY27?

FY26, right. Yeah.

Yeah. I think

we have two sets of businesses under green solutions as you are aware of. One is the Thermax Onsite Energy Solutions that we talk about, which is the biomass-based heating solutions that we provide to our customers on-site.

The other is the wind and solar energy hybrid solutions that we offer to our customers both on BOOT basis. One is on the captive power side that you are aware of.

I think our Thermax Onsite Energy Solutions business has done very well. I think a stable set of numbers from that.

The challenge has been on the First Energy business of ours. We've had one challenge on a project that we're executing down south where one of the contractors has failed to perform as per the contractual terms.

That has forced us to step in and complete the contract or continue execution of that contract. There's been a cost overrun on that account, which involved some picking up some of the challenges which are new to us at that location.

I think it's incurring a bit more of the cost than we had planned originally for, and that's the additional incurrence that we're having, which is reflecting in the results for the period, which is the unexpected impact to our bottom line. From an capacity part of it, we are thereabouts about 250 MW on ground with two, three large one which has been commissioned as on 31st of March and two the other large projects, one in Gujarat and the two more in one more in south that I talked about earlier, which will be commissioned in the next two, three quarters.

I think those would add up to the balance that I mentioned. I think FY27 we would close probably much better than this number.

Understood, sir. Thank and all the best.

Thank you.

Thank you for the opportunity. Rajendran, the first question that I had was on margins in the top two segments.

One could not see any impact of RM headwinds when you call that out in your presentation. Just trying to get a sense whether the margins were impacted by RM headwinds or if that's something that can happen incrementally.

Thanks, Aditya. I think that's an important question for the quarter.

We haven't shown any large impact on the raw material cost for this quarter, for sure, because I think the impact came because of the war sometime in the month of March by which time procurement for the quarter had all been completed and the execution was in progress. I think the price increases that we're seeing in commodities across from steel to styrene to other copper, nickel, etc., I think all of them, I think we're seeing the price movements, for sure.

You are aware of them as well. That is a bit of an challenge for us in this quarter.

Having said that, I think traditionally, I'm sure you have seen that our margin impact on our industrial infra project business is fairly controllable given that we end up tying up on a back-to-back basis on all our bought-outs as well as on contractual costs for large orders. However, on the product business side, we would have typically a shorter range of visibility on the inventory front coverage that we will have.

We would be exposed to some of this challenges that we are having going ahead on the industrial product side. Having said that, these increases have not been substantial as you will also notice, and we are handling the situation at this point of time.

With some coverage available on the inventory front as on March, I think we'll be able to give you a more better understanding of the impact by quarter one numbers. Thanks, Aditya.

I hope I answered your question. Hello?

Yeah.

thank you for taking my questions, Rajendran. My first question is coal gasification.

This is one opportunity where we are technology-ready, but we've never had a chance given that the commercials have not worked. Now that this is a global problem in terms of post the West Asia crisis, do you see any shift in government policy, any viability gap funding, etc.

that has been spoken about for the coal gasification opportunity? That would be question number one.

Thanks, Pulkit. I think overall you're right in identifying the opportunity vis-à-vis the current energy crisis.

That many of our green energy solutions that we offer currently I think are bound for a better, brighter market going ahead. I think you talked about coal gasifications.

While we haven't won any in the recent past, but we're sure that in terms of government coming in to support some of this is something that we would definitely look forward to. Just to mention simultaneously in another one, BioCNG, where we see more of state government policies coming in to support that is an better opportunity that is going to happen for our BioCNG business, and similarly for other solutions that you have at this time.

Yes, overall, I think this energy challenge for India is an good opportunity for us on the green solutions side.

Sure. Your line is actually not very clear, but yeah, I did get what you said.

My second question is on data centers. Since bulk of the data centers globally are not being put on captive power plants or thermal power plants, it's either grid or renewable, is the opportunity size for us in terms of cooling towers relatively small to the overall cooling tower or say the chiller opportunity?

I'm just trying to understand, even if you don't want to talk about the numbers, but the area we can cater to within the data center opportunity is relatively limited given that we'll mostly be using thermal heat in order to convert into those chillers. Is that understanding right in the first place?

Pulkit, I would not be too much in detail to be able to answer that question well, but I will try and get back to you on this to help an answer for that understanding online.

Sure, no problem. Thank you so much, Rajendran, sir.

Thanks.

Hi, sir. Thanks for taking my question.

I had a couple of them. I wanted to understand where is the progress for us on the coal gasification side?

As far as I remember, there has been progress in a pilot facility where your technology has been broadly finalized. Is there progress on that front?

Do you see incremental orders that you can do or partner with players who can utilize your technology? That's my first question.

Kartik, I think that your understanding is right. I think we have the technology solution tested fairly in place.

I think the technology solution, in my understanding, I think hasn't become viable for the market players to progress on this front. This is an area that we have been working on with interested customers who would want to try this out and who would have this in their plans for sustainable energy solution.

I think from an earlier question that we had in this call, we are hoping that there would be some support and this particular area picks up. At this time there's nothing on the order front that I have an update for Q4, but going ahead we're hopeful that things would get better on the space.

Sir,

your strategy here is broadly on the lines of that you will be only offering technology and doing technology partnering. You will not be taking on the risk of executing the full project?

Is that understanding correct?

No, EPC capability we hold, I think EPC would also be an opportunity for us on this.

As far as I remember, there was some talks in the past that you'll be limiting yourself to smaller projects initially or is that [unclear]?

That's for sure. I think we talked about on the EPC front on the industrial infra, what we have been telling the market is that we have been cautious on the margin front, and that I think would apply here as well.

Otherwise, I don't think we're shying away from orders, just that we would be cautious to make sure that our margins better protected. That I think would be the criteria.

Yeah. Thanks, Kartik.

Sir. Sir, what is the outlook for revenue growth next year given that this year the consol revenue growth was just about 3%, 4% and obviously our order book has filled up quite a bit?

I can't give you an number per se, but I think, Atul, yes, the order balance, which is about 27% better than the prior period closing, gives us a better opportunity in terms of posting good numbers on the revenue front. Having said that, I think we have to look forward to executing better and specifically some of the site challenges and the delays that we have seen across customer sites on civil and other places, I think those have been the disturbances in the past that we have seen and have been a bit of cause for our revenue performance over the quarters.

I think also the Middle East-related crisis while at this time it does appear to be something that we have to watch for. I think these are one or two things that I think we have to keep in mind with a good order balance that we have for the execution ahead.

We are confident that the execution plans that we have across various businesses of ours should come through. I think the quarter one and quarter two with this wider balance would tell us really as to how we're able to catch up.

Yes, overall quite positive on our execution front. Okay.

Sir, as of now, I know it is still very early days and probably the impact of crude prices and shortage of gas and petrochemicals is still ahead of us, but looking at your client base and across industries, what is your sense? Are we seeing fair bit of disruption to business activity, especially for smaller scale industries?

Will it have some kind of adverse consequence for your orders, especially in industrial product segment? Yeah.

I think while

you picked up the industrial product segment, but in terms of disturbance as what you talk about, I think we've had some bit of challenge really on our chemicals business, I think which I haven't covered earlier, but I thought I'll speak about it now. I think our chemical business is having a bit of challenge clearly on the raw material side because some of the key raw material like styrene and some on the water treatment and construction chemicals, these have been disturbed in terms of supply as well as price increases.

Availability and booking some of the raw material for our execution, I think, at higher cost and correspondingly having to manage the prices with the customers to avoiding impact to our contribution, I think that's been one reasonably a high challenge for our chemical business at this point of time. We're doing our best in that regard, and we're hopeful that we should be able to maintain our margin numbers and the volume that we have planned out for quarter one.

Yes, and extending the discussion to what you had talked about in terms of smaller this thing as well as our industrial product business is getting impacted. Yes, I think what we started seeing in the month of March was with regards to the gas availability impacting fabrication, smaller units, and that, of course, getting stabilized down the line.

Yes, some bit of challenges around it, and the raw material price increases on various commodities that we've talked about has definitely impacted the operations for some of the smaller vendors. That's where I think talk to you about the cost pressures for quarter one.

Sir, finally, what is the planned capex for FY27 consol entity? I think

we will have a regular capex of about ₹100, ₹150 crore of regular capex that we've maintained. Apart from this, I think we have a few capexes that we have planned on some bit of capacity expansion in our boiler facility as well as in our cooling facility.

They are more, I think I would say some bit of an capacity line extensions kind of capex. I think put together, I think the number would roughly be about ₹250 crore.

Okay. Okay.

Thank you, sir. Yeah.

Thank you for the opportunity. My first question is on the supercritical boiler order from MB Power.

If you can just elucidate more on this order in terms of the execution period and specifically on supercritical boiler for say other utilities, are there similar tenders in pipeline?

Supercritical opportunities I think would continue to be there. I think we have clarified in the past vis-à-vis our stance on the public sector opportunities and the private sector opportunities, and you'll note, of course, our preference on the private sector space.

I think this particular one is also on the private sector as you can see. This order would get executed over a period of 42 45 months timeframe.

I think you know the order value that we have disclosed about. I think the year one would be more focused on design engineering and ordering, and I think it will pick up speed in the coming periods.

Got it. Understood.

Second question on the Middle East part. How much is the exposure in terms of sales for you and specifically each of these segments, maybe on industrial products and industrial infra?

On those exposures, are you seeing any execution challenges in terms of supply chain or cost or payment challenges?

Sorry, can you just repeat the first part of your question? I missed a bit of that.

On the Middle East exposure in terms of sales, which you would have on industrial products as well as industrial infra, right, how much is that and any cost or execution challenges currently related to supply chain or any payment delays currently being noticed? I think

Middle East has been a good opportunity for us over the last 2 years. I think we've been mentioning that.

The opportunity has some order balances for execution at this point of time for us. We haven't seen specifically any delays at this point, and things are fine.

Having said that, in terms of future opportunities, I think hopefully there could be more given the damages that have been there on account of the war. We're hoping for some opportunities coming around on account of that.

The price cost disturbances due to freight and other things was a reality when we were executing it in the month of March as well. That's the space that we will have to be watching about.

However, no executions have got delayed per se at this point of time. Okay.

Can you quantify the exposure? Say Middle East in percentage of order book, or something like that?

I think

we did disclose to you that in quarter three, we had booked a quarter two, we had booked a large ₹450 crore order on the Middle East front in our industrial infra business. That's one among the large ones.

The other ones will be in our industrial product business, which will be of smaller values. I don't have an consolidated number for Middle East on the order balance at this thing, but we will see whether we will get that together and disclose.

Sure. Thanks a lot.

Thanks.

Hi. Congratulations on ending the fiscal with a very strong line-by-line numbers.

Amit, sir, sorry to interrupt. I would request you to be a little bit louder or get the handset near to you.

Yeah. Is it fine now?

That's better. Better.

Able to hear. Go ahead.

Yeah. I think my question is on segment one, we can see a very strong momentum, and this is being there for rising compliance and maybe packaged boiler business.

Can we grow at 15%, 20%, 20% next year on segment one and because you also have some large wins impacting segment one? Second question is on segment two where in the Babcock segment, beyond the utility supercritical order, you might have quite a few large boiler orders.

Can we broadly achieve a 2x top line in '28 vis-à-vis what we did in '25, '26 on second segment? That's two questions for me.

Okay. Yes, I think

on the industrial product bit, I think while, yes, the boiler business is one specific segment and the largest business within that segment. I think we've been commenting over the last couple of quarters, or probably more, on the increasing mix change that's happening in terms of our growth in our Enviro, that's our air pollution control and water treatment businesses, more significantly.

I think those growths of those businesses have been robust as well. Industrial boilers, I think the growth continues to be reasonably good.

On your ask as to whether it would see a 15%, 20% growth, I think I will go back to my comments on that the reasonable working platform on the order book looking good for us on Q1, but I think we'll have to temper that with the war impact across various industries and what decisions that could cause on the capex front, which we'll have to watch carefully. At this time, I think reasonably optimistic, but I think a bit cautious on that for the future.

On the industrial infra front, yes, I think you have seen the recent trend of wins that we have been declaring on the industrial infra space. This will be for the large boiler business.

I think we declared one in quarter two, another one in quarter three, which was from [unclear] Sir, I think, yeah, there's slight disturbance on the line. I'm sorry, sir, if it's only for me.

Is it better, Amit? Yeah.

Sir. Yeah.

Okay. That and I think the supercritical order in quarter four that we talked about, and as is now on the call talked about another opportunity on the data center side on the energy front.

I think we are reasonably seeing a bit of order for that Sorry to interrupt, sir. Yeah.

Sir, the voice is breaking a lot. Just give me a moment.

Sure. I'll disconnect and reconnect your line, just a moment.

We have the management line reconnected. Yes, sir, you can go ahead.

Yeah. Yes.

I was talking to you about the strong momentum on the large orders that we are booking apart from the regular ones that we have a pipeline of. Yes, I think we're bullish, and we're confident of that business doing well basis the pipeline that we're seeing.

I'll limit my comments to that, and I hope I answered to some extent.

Rajendran. Thank you, and good to see the leadership programs at Thermax working very well.

Thank you.

Sure. Thanks, Amit.

Hi, Rajendran. Congratulations on a good quarter.

My first question is on the boiler opportunity which you spoke on the data center side. Is the boiler opportunity much bigger in global markets or is the cooling opportunity?

How does one look at this? I think,

honestly, I think Parikshit, I think this would be a difficult one to quantify at this stage. These are opening up for us.

I think we've been making the similar commentary on the cooling front as well. We're seeing these opportunities.

I think we've won the first set of ones. I think you'll have to give us some time to be able to assess this and let you know on both on the energy side as well as on the cooling side.

Give us some time on this one.

The data center one is on the large boilers. Will it be done through the TBWES or can directly do that?

At least that much

It will be done through TBWES.

TBWES business, okay. There's a second question on the capex.

I think capex and capacity building on the cooling side last time, I think, it was mentioned by the management team that given how this order performance is, the market is quite big and competition and pricing is not that of a bigger concern. How are we planning for building capacity and the capex on the data center business side?

If you can help us understand.

We have a reasonable facility to be able to handle this demand requirement at our Sri City site for our cooling business. I think I earlier mentioned that there is an capex on an expansion that we are doing there this financial year.

That would come in to support the demand that we can expect on this particular one.

Okay. Sure, sir.

Those were my two questions. Thank you.

Thanks.

Good morning, sir, and thanks for this opportunity. My first question is, sir, I see that compared to FY25, it seems there has been a substantial working capital build vis-à-vis the last year.

Can you please provide what are the causes for it, and is there some way that we should look at a reversal of this working capital build in the next year? How should we see it?

I think

this is well observed. You're right.

I think we've had a bit of working capital increase in this particular quarter. This has been caused by some project delays and hence the related collection delays on some of our receivables as well as retentions have happened across a few large orders as well as overall in some portion of our industrial product and industrial infra business.

We are conscious of this fact, and we are focusing on this in the coming quarters to get back on better numbers for working capital and would remain a focus. Yes, thanks for spotting that and noting it.

Should we see this coming off, let's say, if not, let's say, next couple of quarters, but maybe over a period in FY27? Would that be the right way to look at it?

It's not going to, while I'll be hopeful that we should resolve all the overdues in one quarter, but yes, the business realities, I'm sure that we would be able to work it over the next couple of quarters.

Sir, the second question is we had won this contract in Dangote, as I remember, in third quarter. Now usually what we have seen from Thermax and also other companies involved in, let's say, Nigeria and this country, in cases of when hard currency, that is USD or EUR availability is kind of at a stress and when those countries goes into sort of fiscal stress, execution difficulties tends to naturally crop up.

Given that has happened in the past history, what are the risk mitigation measures that we are taking specifically for Dangote?

See, I think while I think this has been the past, we've experienced it as well, though not specifically in the large order that we executed in the past, which was backed up by letter of credit and which will be the case quite a bit. The currently I think the currency, if I have though not been closely following it, but if I know of what we have seen in the recent past, those issues have fairly stabilized for Nigeria.

With the oil prices where they are, I think things are fairly stable is what my last understanding of that matter was. Yes, we're conscious of that, and so we do take care of our payment terms to be secured and so that we are not unduly exposed on the credit risk side.

That would be the case for this as well. I think we'll be cautious on this front, for sure.

Just if you can just answer just a bookkeeping question because a lot of the order wins that has happened this year and hopefully the next year is TBWES. Can you provide let's say a broad ballpark number that what would be the order book of TBWES and maybe its revenues and margin for FY26?

That's all from my side.

For FY26, I think you'll have to wait for that. That this is a separate subsidiary and an 100% subsidiary, its financials will be available in the public space.

I think you should wait for it, yeah. We'll get that out.

That's all, sir.

Sure. Thanks.

Hi, sir. Thanks for the opportunity.

Just wanted to ask you a little bit more on the large boiler order that you received in March. What would be your capacity on these boilers?

How much could you execute? How many more orders could you take on in this field?

I think we have three facilities for this overall for the boiler business. I think we would be able to execute this particular one.

While I think, yes, to that extent that there has been other demands as well, I think we talked about it on the order flow side as well as a regular business that we would have. I think, yes, our ability to service would be constrained to that extent of capacity becoming available.

I talked to you about the expansion that we are doing to debottleneck the facility to certain extent. That would keep us ready for any opportunities that might come in the future.

I think and we also have ability to develop and execute some of them through outsourced facilities on the fabrication front. I think fairly confident of what we have won and what we will be able to execute.

I think the supercritical opportunities if they were to come, we would be obviously be looking at it closely on our abilities to pick them at the right price and being able to execute. I don't think I answered you fully on the capacity front, but I think that's something that we review that closely in terms of abilities to execute orders.

Understood, sir. Would you be able to give some sort of quantification of the pipeline for these kinds of boiler orders, specifically these large boilers?

What is the bid pipeline and what is the outlook for the next two to three years or even more near term, one to two years?

I don't have that number. Sorry.

This particular one, I don't have at this time to share anything to.

Sure, sir. Thank you.

Thank you.

Thanks for taking my question. Sir, I have two questions.

One on the legacy orders which were pending earlier to an extent of around ₹500 to ₹600 crore in the books of the company. What would be the status of those legacy orders?

My second question is regarding the margin profile for the large orders that you have booked both on the data center side and even on the boiler side. Is the margin profile of those orders much better than the margin profile that you are currently having in your current set of business and ultimately how to view the margin profile for the upcoming orders also on these two areas?

Okay.

I think, yes, I think we've probably failed to put an update in the investor presentation that we were planning to. I think on those low-margin orders that we had specifically in our BioCNG business as well as our FGD business as well as some bit on our power and energy solutions business, I think we've almost executed them.

At least the BioCNG one, I think very clearly there. I think the large project, NRL, that we have talked about on the bioenergy solutions and the two large FGD projects that we are currently executing are the balance closer completion.

NRL one, I think we've talked about the cost overruns and this thing. We are hopeful.

We are keeping an eye on it. I think it would take the entire year and a bit to get that order to its closure.

We're hopeful that we have the right cost estimates at this time for its closure. However, the FGD orders that we are executing at this time are better off for us, and the margins are stable there.

On the BioCNG side, I think we are in the performance trial stage for most of our orders. I think that quarter one and two of those for this year, we should be able to complete them, and that should settle them.

All the new set of orders that we have booked across our industrial infra, industrial product, I think every other places, I think they have been with better margin target profile that we have internally. Talking of this cooling as well as the supercritical order that you talked about, the margins on the cooling one are good.

I think on the supercritical one, we have been conscious on the margin front when we booked this. I think they're stable and as per our target margin profile for the particular segment.

I wouldn't be able to obviously talk about the margin specifically because it's a single order, and I'm sure you'll appreciate that. Sure.

There is sufficient buffer that you would have booked taking into account the higher RM prices which are prevailing right now?

The order was finalized in the month of March. The prevalent situation obviously would have been factored in.

Yes, but we have to manage that with the developing situation, and that would have to be handled over a period of time as well because it's a long term. It will be executed over the next three to four years.

Understood. Understood.

Thank you, sir.

Hi, sir. Thanks for taking my question.

First question on if you could give some color in terms of the heating, cooling, electric boiler, how that has performed in industrial product. There was a kind of double-digit margin which we have been doing last year.

We did good EBIT margin there. This year also the margin has came off by 100 more than 100 bps, but still we're in double digit.

Just wanted to understand what one should take it as a sustainable margin for FY27 and how has been the performance of each of the sub-verticals in the industrial product business?

Okay. Thanks, Amit, for that question.

I think we broadly talk about the industrial product business of the multiple businesses that under them, but we haven't disclosed specifically any margin profiles for each one of them. Having said that, I think I can see that your question is around the margin drop over the last year on the industrial product business.

The prior period had a set of good projects where there were good savings opportunities for us, having those projects having been picked up during a certain cycle of commodity cost being higher and being executed at a time when the commodity cost got cooled off. We had good savings opportunity in some of them.

In one of the businesses, we've missed a bit of export opportunity which had better margin profile. That's been one.

One which I can talk about more clearly is on the Danstoker business that we have in the Europe. I think we have a mix of oil and gas as well as biomass-based boilers, and I think the margin mix on the biomass-based boilers are better off than the oil and gas boilers.

In the last year cycle, the oil and gas boilers were much more executed than the biomass ones. We see the mix changing for the year ahead.

I think that was also cause of the change in the margin that you saw in that segment. A couple of reasons for this thing.

Broadly, I think the mix change on the individual businesses I think was the main cause for the margin dip. Yes, we would, I think, look forward to some improvements going ahead, subject to, of course, commodity cost impacts.

Right. Sir, in the infra business, does this boiler order, I'm just again asking for better understanding, has the price variation clause and second, is it the correct understanding that at least this is at the margin accretive, margin dilutive to the overall firm-level margins?

If you could give some color for this utility boiler order which we have taken, that will be helpful.

Thanks, Amit. I think I'll reiterate what I think I told earlier that I would not be able to talk specifically about this job margin because it's a specific order.

I can't also discuss any bilateral clauses that we have in the contracts. Having said that, I think firm level, segment level target margins we have kept in mind at the time of finalizing this order.

I think that's the confidence that I can have at this time.

Right. With this order, and as you explained already about the legacy order status on that orders, can we see meaningful improvement further for the industrial infra business?

We had a good improvement this year in terms of margin. Is that on the card or this should stabilize at the current levels?

I think the current levels are good levels. I think you have seen them increasing over the last two, three years.

I will just draw your attention to an specific state incentive that we have been receiving and which we have been disclosing in our quarterly and in our annual results as well. That's an accretion to that business which has happened over the last two, three years.

That's available I think we've disclosed it. It will be till 27, 28 cycle.

I think that is one piece of profit that I think is for a limited cycle. Otherwise, yes, I think with the flow of orders and certain operating leverage, I think we should definitely be having confidence on our margins going.

Right. Sir, lastly, on the data center, is there any lead time or you have to get on some approval process, which takes some time?

Just wanted to understand when did you started applying for this orders and when did they converted for you? If you could let us understand the timelines, the process to get this orders?

Are you in touch with multiple OEMs in US to get further business for cooling towers or at least where we got the order with that, are we looking for orders from the same vendor or talking to more OEMs there? Some color on that, please.

Yeah.

Yes, Amit, I think, but the color is going to be limited. I'm not obviously going to discuss whom, what, etc.

I think, yes, as we I think earlier commented, we're confident of the order pipeline and the discussions that we are having. This is something that we will continue to comment in the coming quarters and have nothing more to add than what I have told earlier.

Thanks.

Hi. Good morning, team.

Just a small follow-up questions more on the bookkeeping side. Sir, can you help us give what is the broad order book split between fixed price and variable price projects and orders?

I think

you can fully assume that all our orders are fixed price orders. There would be a few which if at all very and large ones if any that we would have price variation clauses.

I think they would be fairly few and far. I think so by and large, all our orders are fixed orders.

Because this is more pertinent with respect to large orders. There's one or two of the large orders that we have recently won in the last two quarters if they have price variation clause and it changes the mix materially.

This is the reason why. Should we assume broadly 90% is all fixed price or in value terms, how would this be?

As I said to you, I think you should assume fixed price orders because that's primarily the nature of all our businesses and orders.

Sure. Given the way the execution has panned out of the overall backlog while we have these three, four large orders on which we can count on, what percentage of the backlog has execution cycle beyond 12 months?

I think

some of the large jobs that we have picked up, naturally the execution cycles are more than this thing. I think the supercritical one I commented earlier as well.

Would all clearly exceed 12 months. They would more be in 16 to 18 kind of ranges for execution.

Got it. Sure.

Thank you, and best wishes, team. Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you for the opportunity again. Rajendran, a few questions.

As in the context of the first question is that you had in green solutions a partner who did not fully do the work and then the company had to take it up. In the same year earlier, there was an issue on the design engineering part with a certain partner as well.

I'm just trying to get a sense is this becoming an issue that the company would want to kind of see through and address, and what steps are being taken in this direction wherein the partner network is better of than earlier?

Agree with the question, Aditya. I think unfortunately the issue has been with the same partner that we've had, and so it's not across multiple partners who would want to give you some color around that.

Yes, the impact I think we've explained that. We aren't facing this across our projects or across vendors.

We are conscious of this, and for future orders as well. Thanks.

The second question that I had was more linked up to the order inflows that have happened in the year on the domestic side inside industrial infra. With broadly being flat YoY if I take away the thermal order, I think expectations would have been better for the year.

Just trying to get a sense across customer sites where have the disappointments come, and if in those segments everything is changing for the better as we speak through? I think

our industrial infra business, I think the two other parts, I think apart from what we have talked about, I think FGD I think you're aware of. We've been speaking about it for the last one or two, one year or more.

I think on the dry down of orders on that front. BioCNG business I think has also been less on orders, but I think in the recent past, we've won some change orders with our existing clients.

Otherwise, I think there's been a change in the market, and I think there's some bit of slowdown. I think BioCNG business order book has also been not as per our expectations.

That's another area that I think, yes, which is part of industrial infra which has not picked up. Yeah.

I think those would be the concerns for us at this time, but I think as I said earlier, BioCNG is a business that we're looking forward to of better opportunities and better market down the line.

Any comment on the green methanol endeavor of the company wherein a certain small quantum of capacity is being set up, but how does the company think through it and any investment targets that you would want to share?

I don't have an current update, but I think, Aditya, maybe I might be able to get back to you on this if there's any further development. Nothing at this time that I have to share.

Thank you, Rajendran, for this useful responses. Those were my questions, sir.

Thank you.

Hi. Good afternoon and congratulations on a great set of numbers.

I had two questions. Wanted to understand following on to the earlier participants with respect to the data center, do we say that we have less of competition in the North American cooling solutions and our value add is higher?

Wanted to get a sense around when the qualifications are done with probably say the hyperscalers, the incremental orders, do we get a higher chance with the same hyperscaler or do we is it like a each project is a fresh fight, like wanted to understand that? Second thing is we've been very vocal in our earlier calls that we'll be staying away from very heavy projects, citing probably the FGD as a one of our lessons.

Then this recent ₹1,600 crore of order that probably we have taken, it's got very long delivery timelines. Wanted to understand what was our thought process behind it.

If you may allow, I have one more question, but yeah.

Nikhil, I think the data center piece, I think I have spoken enough. There have been multiple questions.

I think I've clarified as much as we can. I don't have anything to add beyond that.

Nothing specific on the parts that you had to ask on that one. However, we'll add on the heavy projects or the 16 and the supercritical order that this thing.

I think supercritical we have been earlier clarifying that we are staying away from possible challenges in our abilities to execute any supercritical orders on the public sector side and had shown our preference and inclination to execute on the private sector side. I think you'll see that this one is on the private sector side.

Yes, the margin concern that we had, I think is something that I have commented earlier on the call already. Yes, it's a slightly long cycle order, but I think this is a sort of a breakthrough as well for us in terms of the supercritical business and sets up our capability to execute more on this particular space.

I think, yes, we're seeing this opportunity as our ability to get into this space as well as execute it profitably. I'll stop there.

Thanks.

Thanks. I think I have nothing more to add.

I think I hope I have been able to answer the questions today on the call. Thank you, and we'll look forward to seeing you again in the quarter one call.

Thanks.