Welcome to today's event where we have the pleasure to present WindowMaster, as we can see here on the front page. Half-year report, half-year results is the topic of today, fresh from press this, I would say morning, but it's more midday.
To help us today to to help us through today's presentation, we are joined by CEO Erik Boyter and CFO Steen Overgaard Sørensen. Steen will do most of the financial presentation, and and Erik will join us in the Q&A session.
As always, there's a box down below, feel free to ask questions. We will do the Q&A in the end of the sessions, but do feel free to do it during the presentation.
Do feel free to do it in Danish, I will translate to the best of my abilities. For now, I will hand the call over to you, Steen.
Steen Overgaard Sørensen
Thank you very much. As you said, we sent out the financial report this morning for the first half year.
I'm just running through some of the highlights of that report. If I start actually with the pipeline, we see a strong pipeline development here actually in Q2 and Q3, and especially from our partnership we have with FIEGER, which is a louvre solution that supports our business also.
There we see a growth, which is also when we look into the rest of the year and also into '27 is supporting our ambitions that we want to grow for the future. If you look at the order intake, we have this time looked a little bit differently on the way we present.
We have three business areas within WindowMaster, which consists of what we call building business area, which is project-driven, where we are deeply involved in the solutions that is implemented. Then we also have a product segment or business area, which is more over the counter and also towards the key accounts.
That's where we don't necessarily have the contact to the final installation or customer. Finally, we have what is called safety business area, which is also a company called Climatic A/S.
It's mainly focused on the Danish market and a bit in Germany. Also if you have read our statement from this morning, we are looking whether to divest in this business area.
That's why we want to focus a little bit more on, you could say, the core business of WindowMaster, which is our solution within fire and also natural ventilation. That's why we have split it up like that because we do see quite a strong development in our order intake on this building business area where we've seen a growth over the last 12 months compared to the previous 12 months of 31%, which is pretty strong and also fit with our strategy that we set out in 2022.
We unfortunately see a little bit of a decline in our product business area. We have lost some key accounts, but we have quite an ambitious goal to regain some of that market share, and that we are focusing on as we speak.
Finally, yeah, the safety business is declining in order intake, and that's also why we have taken the decision to look for potentially other owners of that activity. However, the pipeline in the safety business is strong and solid, there's activity out there.
If we jump to the next slide here, I have put also the net sales, and that's as also stated in our guidance back from May, we did see a very slow Q1, primarily linked to weather conditions. A lot of building projects was postponed and could not be put into the ground, and that gives a delay in the whole construction phase or refurbishment phase within the building industry.
Especially also the Climatic activity was pretty hardly [hit?] on that because of the weather, we could not go on the roof due to snow on roof surfaces.
We are back on track, and as also you see here in Q2, we're pretty strong, and again, especially within the building business area, we see a strong development. That is also continuing to what we know of Q3, we are optimistic on that.
Finally, yeah, there's the EBITDA and EBIT levels. They match to the model we have in WindowMaster, and there we see, you could say, once the turnover is there, then also profitability is following.
We see again here an EBITDA ratio of close to 10%. It's not at the level we wish to be.
We want to be at 15%, but still we are on that track from a profit point of view. Finally, here also we have the key figures or the key numbers, as also put into the statement early on.
There are no surprises as such. There are no special circumstances here.
Net working capital, if we take that and focus on that, then it's a little bit higher, but that is due to seasonality and more activity here in Q2. Net working capital is also on a little bit on the high side, but as we normally see also for the second half of this year, activity are picking up, and that means that net working capital will decline in the second half.
That's also with a pattern we saw back in 2025, and we assume and expect that pattern to also be the case for '26. Finally, equity ratio again, yeah, linked to the poor performance in Q1 mainly, here we also do expect that we will be back on the level we saw also in '25, yeah, in the year 2025, and expect in the range of close to 25% when we end the year, as it looks right now.
All in all, these numbers support the guidance we also put forward in here as stated here. We do expect a turnover of 2 285 to 305 and also an EBITDA level of 30 to 40 million.
That is supported again by the pipeline, but also the order intake as we see it right now. Again coming from this strong business area of buildings where we continuously see a growth occurring.
On that note, we are positive. It's also supported by the numbers we are looking into from July, but also what we see on the order intake for August as of today.
I think that was it from the half-year account, and I think I'll hand it over to you.
Perfect. Let's jump into some questions.
There is some questions about the Climatic. There's one here, is it possibility to close it?
Has that been a possibility, or do you think there is a value for a buyer? There's also one asking what is the field of buyers?
Is there any competitors? Is there any capital funds, equity funds that could be looking into that?
A little bit about is there a value in Climatic? You're talking about they actually have a whole autumn momentum, and it is a sale and not a closure.
Maybe a little bit about the fields of potential buyers?
Erik Boyter
Maybe I should respond to that one. We see a more value in selling the business off to potential buyers, and those could be either in Denmark, or it could also be that they would be in the Nordic market, Norway or Sweden.
If you look into the business, there's a lot of service contracts and there's also a pipeline of opportunities. Unfortunately, they have not materialized yet, but there is going forward.
We reckon we can sell most of the business for a price and get out of it with skin in the game, you could say. Also the questions about closing it down, that is not something we wish to do, and that would actually have a bigger negative impact that selling the activities off.
We are optimistic that we can find a potential buyer for the activity.
To stay in Climatic and maybe also a little bit about the message, but first when I read it, it was 3 million that it had costed on the bottom line, and then you mentioned 10 million. I think people are putting it together as could we have the explanation?
You are indicating that you will go after cost savings in '27 of 10 10 million Danish kroner and Climatic as a part of that, but I think that was 3 million. Maybe we can specify a little bit on how that should be understood?
Erik Boyter
It's because actually the 10 million relates to other cost savings. What we are saying here is that last year we had a negative impact on our financial results on 3.1 million.
We expect could be similar this year depending on what we can sell it off to and also some cost savings and so on. The impact we are trying to look at is around 10 million going into '27.
We have actually also have some cost reductions on employees, which was announced today to the organization. This will impact fully around 10 million, including Climatic.
If we look at kind of the 20 2020 2025, it's around 10 million impact, yeah.
So
Erik Boyter
2025 is
the base year, and then that will give you an estimated 10 million. Can we talk a little bit about that, because it looks like your order book is accelerating in your project division, and that is somewhere where you have to hire people to keep the project there.
A little bit about how you balance this cost savings with actually the ambitions and what looks to be an accelerating project business for you?
Erik Boyter
Actually, if we look into what we have done on the employee side, you can say, part is the Climatic overall you can say accounts. Then we have looked into our business all over, and we have reduced an amount of business development managers that create specification sales around in our different markets, that's UK, Germany, and Switzerland.
We have also reduced in Denmark where we have reduced people that have in connection with Climatic. Overall, that is the 10 million.
We don't see that the reductions in the business development side will have a negative impact on our business because we have IT systems that makes the rest of the business development managers around be more efficient and more on a higher performance level, yeah.
Check, check, check. Then there's a little bit about the investments in Germany.
You mentioned these 20 million. There's a question here, is that in '27, '28?
How should we divide in that? Is the 20 million you want to put into your factory in Germany, is that isolated to '26, or is it also divided into the coming years, '27 and '28?
Erik Boyter
Steen, maybe you just should answer first on this one, and then I will also add on to it,
Steen Overgaard Sørensen
yeah. From a you could say investment point of view, we have already started that process here in '26, and depending on how fast the process goes with refurbishment of the factory, then, yeah, we have a facility with a bank, a local bank, and we will use that on the go.
It depends what is possible. There's a lot of regulations in Germany that you have to apply to, and that defines a little bit the speed of that investment.
We have a plan that it will run so '26 for sure, but also full year '27, and it might be run into the second half of 2028 before we are fully done with that. Exactly how the investments will occur is not set in stone.
Again, that depends on, yeah, the speed of the project. The short
question, is the 20 million extra on top of what you already invested, or is that the total investment?
Steen Overgaard Sørensen
That's
the total investment in the German facility, perfect, yeah. No, that's the total.
Steen Overgaard Sørensen
Yeah.
Erik Boyter
Maybe just adding on. What are we doing here?
We are updating our production facility so they have facilities actually with the potential of having two shifts because that's the beauty with the production we have. We can actually double and triple with the two shifts, three shifts if we really want to do that, it's not a question about the machines, but it's a question about labor in the factory.
That the capacity can move for us. It's certainly also on the energy efficiency on the building because we are using gas at the moment in the building for heating, and here we're going to go over to electricity for heating, and that will also have an impact on the cost levels going forward.
It's all about energy efficiency, and there is also grants into this that we'll get from the German government because that's very different from Denmark. They will pay part of the investment we actually doing in the building.
I think Steen could elaborate what that is actually.
Steen Overgaard Sørensen
Especially on the insulation side, but also for new heating systems and solutions, one-to-one or 80% of that investment we will get as a subsidies from the German government. That will be paid out once you have an invoice, you get the money.
It is pretty straightforward. The 20 million is a net sum, and so actually the overall investments is a little bit higher, but the net cost for WindowMaster will be the 20 million.
Then that will not just be capacity, you will actually see some cost savings out of these investment, it sounds to me, going into the future. Is that correctly understood, on the energy side?
Steen Overgaard Sørensen
Correct.
Perfect. Then there's a little bit about the adjustment you made to your guidance earlier this year, trying to understand the building blocks and the mathematics between actually a small adjustment to the top line and a larger adjustment to the EBITDA.
You have a high operational gearing, but mathematically, it looks like that was very, very high. Was there some extra cost or something that we should understand to do the building blocks on the guidance adjustments you made, I think, earlier this summer?
Steen Overgaard Sørensen
Maybe I can comment. It's that's the, you would say, the operating model of WindowMaster.
Turnover upwards and downwards hurt the bottom line pretty hard because we do have a fixed cost base that is very fixed, to speak, unless we do adjustments as we have indicated here with the employees. That is the mechanism.
Again, it's also important to say it also goes the other way. More turnover goes fast.
We have, as also seen in the financial report, you could see our margins are solid, and especially within the building business area, it's very strong. More turnover there, but also less, brings good value very fast.
Perfect. Then a little bit about the market development.
You touched a little bit upon it there, Steen, but the question here is you also have visibility into August. How does the market feel compared to Q1, compared to when you were adjusting your guidance?
Are you continuing to see this pick up? I think you alluded a little bit to that that's actually what you're seeing out there in the market activity.
Erik Boyter
Maybe I should respond to that. We are seeing more activity again, much more than we saw; Q1 was very disappointing.
We have seen, you can say, since mid Q2, we have seen actually an acceleration of activity. That's also why we have a record order intake for the first six months.
We have never had so much in order as this first half. We see things picking up, but especially in the buildings business area, we are seeing that's where we are much more in control of the buildings.
Also our service department is actually strong and really developing, and we are seeing refurbishment projects coming along on a regular basis. That is, you can say, is really developing positive, and it was a big part of our accelerating core strategy.
What we are seeing, and we have touched also on this, is on our product side where we actually supply to distribution and to manufacturers. We have actually seen that over the last couple of years, mainly manufacturers have not been running very well because high interest rate, a lot of them are much more targeting residential area.
There we have seen because of high interest rate around that the market has been down, and it has been a bit more slow. It's not only because we have lost market share, it's because the activity level in the building and especially residential have been down.
Let's look a little bit on the structure. If we always have this, the German economy uptake, the big plans, the refurbishment, which I think is one of your strong sides, and the green agenda sides, compared to that we're actually seeing interest rising right now.
Is it your feeling that you can be a little bit comfortable with this development you've seen here lately, even if the interest is rising, because it's actually coming from areas, like the German economy pick up, the business activities, and maybe the refurbishment areas?
Erik Boyter
You can say our German market has always performed quite well, it's not like it's up and down in Germany. For us, it's developed over time, slowly, and it's kind of a good base for our company, yeah.
Of course, we can see that there's still not an effect of all the government debt that has been taken and going into the economy. We can see it, of course, on our factory where we can get grants for our things, yeah, but I think it's also a question about it takes a bit of time to come into the market.
Germany in general, I feel it's a steady diesel engine that runs, but it could run a bit more faster, and I think that's what we're all waiting for, yeah.
A little bit about the structure, the interest rising, as you say, they hurt the residential side, but you're more on the refurbishing and at the business activity side. Do you feel comfortable with what you kind of have seen here in Q2 and Q3 continuing into the rest of the year?
Yeah.
Erik Boyter
Yes, you can see it on our guidance. Our experience is second half is always better than first half, a lot better, yeah, because that's how it is, yeah, because projects get finished, and that's the rhythm of the building industry.
We talk about refurbishment. I think we should touch a little bit on what is our core business in that, and it's public building, it's offices, it's schools, it's, oh, universities.
That has been a very good area for us, and this is also where we see this EU regulations are targeting higher refurbishment rates from 1 to 2 to 3% and so on, and that will have an impact on WindowMaster over time. We still need to see a lot more from our own government that it opens up for this because there's also restrictions on how much the local authorities around in Denmark are allowed to use of money, yeah.
We need to see that being a little bit more loose. If that is loosened, you'll see it's a big potential for WindowMaster.
Military buildings might be the place for Denmark, you'd bet on. Joke.
Erik Boyter
You never know. If we do have military projects in our portfolio, we will often not be allowed to disclose them.
Disclose it, I know that, yeah, yeah. Then there's a expectation of a more positive cash flow with the returning of the working capital and including that you also might sell some of your business and cost saving.
Could we expect maybe returning to share buybacks, dividends, or would you prefer to bring down the debt level at current levels?
Erik Boyter
There's two sides to that question. We, of course, would always like to reduce our debt levels, but I don't think our debt levels are extravagant currently, but they are in balance.
That's one thing. Another thing, I think we also want to grow the business.
Acquisitions is also part of our agenda, and they come on a opportunistic level, and we're always interest to do that. If we cannot find any acquisitions then we might see that we will return and do dividend yet again, or buybacks is also a possibility.
That's all part of the, you can say, the ammunition to uphold the share value. We are investing also in product development and so on, we use our cash to develop the business.
That's the biggest priority.
The biggest priority, yes. Then no mention of the United States in the half-year report.
Is ambition for still the same, and can you tell us whether some of the order intake has been in this region?
Erik Boyter
North America and the US, we are quite optimistic about this. We have also mentioned in the past, this is a long-term project.
You cannot see this, and I also know from history from some of our biggest Danish companies into this market that it took many years for them to get return on their investment and to develop and so on. I have always said it's a long-term, and we are there to stay, and we are developing.
We wanted to develop more aggressively, but we also have to be much more clever in what we select in the market. I can say that the tariffs that are on the market have not affected our business in the US.
Our margins in the US and North American market have actually grown, even with the tariffs. It's still one of our big areas of investment, and it's also a high priority.
We don't mention it because there's nothing new to mention here.
Steen Overgaard Sørensen
Maybe just a supporting comment is that we do see a strong growth compared to last year. It follows what we wanted to see, and I would say we're on track on that side.
At the end of the year for the full-year report, we will of course comment on it, and there we do expect some positive developments at that stage, yeah. Then
final question, I don't think we have more time. No, one one more question I think I can push in with the deadline.
How sure are you to to reach the EBITDA target? There's it's very back-end loaded.
Maybe more, how sure are you about the order book that needs to be delivered in that year in in the second half of this and not being pushed into '27? We do understand that if the revenue comes, we have seen historically no problems with the with the earnings in in WindowMaster.
A little bit about the comfort about the order book and and and the the fulfillment of the order book in the second half of the year. Is that what you are Is that giving you comfort in your EBITDA guides?
Erik Boyter
Will you answer that, Steen?
Steen Overgaard Sørensen
I think that there are two areas that supports the guidance. The pipeline, that's also where we put in when do we expect actually to close to an order.
That is pretty front-loaded if you look at when do we expect an order. Both the pipeline, but also the orders, and there we believe it looks as has done the other years, that we will fulfill a lot of that in the second half of this year.
I think with the knowledge we have on the table, we are pretty confident in that guidance. You never know what happens, but with the knowledge we have, I think we have a good feeling on that.
Then, of course, that was the last question for one long-term shareholders to others. What should drive the return?
I'm asking the biggest shareholder and one of the biggest shareholders here on this call, a little bit about the shareholder return and what should drive this for the long-term investors?
Erik Boyter
The market decides the share price, yeah, and that I cannot influence, yeah. I can influence it with doing good results for WindowMaster.
I think also the platform of the First North might also keep our share price down as such, because there is not enough you can say, not liquidity enough on the market, yeah, because if somebody came to me and wanted to buy the company, then the valuation would be a lot higher than what you see on the market today, yeah. That is, of course, an issue that we are faced with.
I will say that as a shareholder, I'm here for the long term, but I certainly also want a return, a higher return than what I have seen over the last couple of years, and that is what we are working towards.
I think that would be a very good place to end this call. Don't think we can do it much better.
No, perfect. Thank you to you both for taking us through your results and answering questions, and thank you for the audience listening in.
May everybody have a nice weekend.
Erik Boyter
Thank you very much, Jan.
Thank you.
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