Covivio Hotels SCA

Covivio Hotels SCA

19.90
EUR
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3.57BMarket Cap

Q2 FY2026 · Earnings Call TranscriptJuly 20, 2026

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Covivio H1 2026 results presentation. I am Moira, the Chorus Call operator.

I would like to remind you that all participants will be in listen-only mode, and the conference is being recorded. The presentation will be followed by a Q&A session.

You can register for questions at any time by pressing * and 1 on your telephone. For operator assistance, please press * and 0.

At this time, it's my pleasure to hand over to Christophe Kullmann, CEO of Covivio. Please go ahead.

Christophe Kullmann

Good morning, everyone. Thanks for joining us today.

Paul and I are pleased to present Covivio's '26 half-year results. Let me start with a quick reminder of Covivio's profile.

As Covivio benefits from a diversified business model built around three leading platforms on a high-quality portfolio concentrated in Europe's most attractive market. This positioning underpins the resilience of our portfolio and support our long-term value creation strategy.

Let me now walk you through our key achievement and performance during the first half '26. We deliver a solid first half with 2.2% like-for-like revenue growth and a 97% occupancy rate.

Our balance sheet further improve, with LTV at 38.6% and net debt-to-EBITDA at 10.5 times. This translated into strong earning growth, with recurring net result per share up 7.3% year-on-year and EPRA NTA per share up 1.6% since year-end.

First, let me briefly comment on the current real estate market environment. As you all know, the first half was marked by geopolitical uncertainty, volatile financial markets, inflation concern, and an evolving interest rate environment.

However, beyond this volatility, the long-term fundamentals supporting our business remained firmly in place. In offices, occupier demand continue to concentrate on prime asset and central locations, reinforcing the appeal of our portfolio.

In Germany, the structural housing shortage persist, while recent regulatory development have reduced uncertainty. In hotels, fundamentals continue to improve, with RevPAR expectation revised upwards in the semester and limited new supply across key European markets.

More importantly, Covivio is particularly well-positioned to benefit from this trends, and our strategy is fully aligned with these structural growth drivers. In offices, occupier demand continue to shift toward prime buildings in central location.

This is exactly where our portfolio is concentrated, with nearly 90% of our asset located in city center or dynamic business hubs. Our strategy, combining prime location, high-quality asset, and a strong tenant experience, allowing us to capture demand where is the strongest.

In German resi, our portfolio is concentrated in major cities, particularly Berlin, where favorable demographic trends and the persistent housing shortage continue to support demand. In hotels, we have steadily increased our exposure to a sector benefiting from attractive long-term fundamentals, particularly in Southern Europe.

With that in mind, let me hand over to Paul, who will take you through our operational and financial performance in more details.

Paul Arkwright

Thank you, Christophe, and good morning, everyone. The first half has been active on asset management front for us, which has driven positive results.

Starting with page 10 on portfolio. Despite a muted investment market, we have been able to continue to improve both the quality of the portfolio and its profitability.

Overall, what you see is that we closed for €223 million of disposals in H1, 89% of it being offices outside city centers. In H1, we signed for €124 million of new disposal agreements.

In parallel, as you see on the right part of the slide, we spent €312 million of investments, with a large part being in hotels: €153 million of acquisitions at more than 7% target yield, and €159 million of capex, mainly related to developments. We will detail it later on, but we progressively increased the yield of our pipeline thanks to the launch of new developments at more than 7% yield.

In terms of investment and moving to page 11, the main news of this first half relates to acquisitions. We bought through our dedicated hotel subsidiary, Covivio Hotels, four hotels in Milan and one in Costa del Sol in Spain.

Those acquisitions are very interesting for us for three main reasons. The first one is that we increase our exposure to hotel in the south part of Europe, most dynamic markets.

The second is we buy top-located hotel at above 7% target yield. The third one is that we benefit from very long-term income visibility thanks to 20 years average lease term.

On the development side and staying in hotels, we delivered in H1 the first redevelopments inside our value-add hotel portfolio. Let's see page 12.

We will talk more about these value-add hotel portfolio later on today. If you focus first on this delivery, this is a very interesting example of all the potential of our hotel platform.

We are in Nice, top tourist city, with a building where we own the Mercure Hotel and the Méridien Hotel. As you see on the left part of the slide, we renovated the Mercure Hotel after having bought the OpCo.

We target a 12% yield on capex, and we are well on track to it thanks to a plus 32% growth in RevPAR after the reopening of this hotel in May. We already booked €22 million of value creation.

The second interesting part is that we took over the management of the hotel with our own operating platform, Wojo. Wojo is already managing the Méridien Hotel, and as you can see on the right part of the slide, this has been a great success since its repositioning in 2020.

By sharing the management of those two hotels, we do continue to optimize the profitability and to increase the results of both hotels. Let's move now to disposals and to offices, page 13.

We already communicated during our full-year results on the signing of the agreement for this new JV on our Thales Campus in Vélizy. The deal has been closed in the first half in April, and the Thales third building has been delivered early July.

Now we have a 12 years firm lease with Thales for 38,000 square meters. Then on German residential, page 14.

The investment market has been particularly impacted by the geopolitical environment and by the expropriation risk in Berlin. In this context, we focus ourselves in improving the quality of the portfolio with modernization capex financed by the disposal of individual apartments.

Although the amounts are so far still limited, but we wanted to do more, and we will explain how later on, the yield gap between privatization made at 2.6% and capex spending at 7% is very positive for the profitability of the German residential portfolio. Finally, on portfolio, let's see the evolution of the valuation, page 15.

What we can say is that the asset management worked enabled us to slightly increase the value of the portfolio by 0.5% on a like-for-like basis. In offices first, we benefited from the positive reversion on the rents in Milan to compensate further decreases in the business hubs and on non-core assets.

In German residential, the rental growth by 3.4% supported the valuation of the portfolio. In hotels, the strong performance of the south part of Europe, as you see in the slide, was a main driver of the plus 1% increase in value.

Overall, a resilient portfolio in this semester, gaining quality. The performance has also been good on operating performance, and let me start with revenues, page 17.

We recorded €349 million group share in revenues in H1. The decrease that can occur is related to the fact that we recorded an indemnity from Suez when they vacated the CB21 tower last year.

The full indemnity was recorded in H1 2025, and we also have the impact of the disposals. Nevertheless, on a like-for-like basis, you see that the performance has been solid overall with plus 2.2% growth thanks to 1 point of indexation, increase in occupancy, and also increase in variable revenue in hotel.

As you see on the right part, we also gain visibility in our cash flow thanks to an increase by one year of the lease maturity up to 7.4 years. Let's go now more into details and starting with hotels, page 18.

New strong performance in H1. Variable revenue first accelerated their growth in Q2, and they end the first half with a plus 3.2% growth on a like-for-like basis.

You see the split on the right side of the slide. The performance have been solid across geographies, exception made with Belgium due to a VAT increase from 6% to 12%.

On the opposite, Spain has been very strong and benefited from a flight to Europe of tourists in the context of the Iran war. Fixed rent are up by 1.2% in a context of low indexation.

You can see that especially in France with 0.1%. The good news is that indexation should increase next year with higher inflation.

Good performance also in office, as you see page 19. The semester has been muted on the letting market with again a decrease in the take-up.

This hides a strong polarization of the office market in favor of central location and in favor of Grade A buildings with top level of services. This is why in this market, our premium positioning is bearing fruits with 45,000 square meters of new lettings and with 58,000 square meters of renewals, alongside 17 years average maturity and a plus 10% rent uplift on those renewals.

On the releases for 18,000 square meters, already 50% of it is re-let or under exclusivity, should be signed in the coming weeks. This drive an increase of the occupancy rate by 50 bps, as you see page 20, up to 95.6%, and I would say a good 1.6% like-for-like rental growth despite a continued decrease of indexation, which should increase again in 2027.

Then German residential, page 21. We recorded a positive semester with a plus 3.4% growth in a context, first of all, of lower indexation in Berlin and in North Rhine-Westphalia, which is temporary.

Another temporary effect, which is increase in vacant apartment for two reason: modernization programs and privatization. You see on the right side of the slide that there is reasons to be optimistic for an acceleration of this growth thanks to the new Mietspiegel in Berlin, which grow by 6.7% for our own apartment.

That's for the rent and the operating performance in hotel. You also probably remember that we mention our target to increase other source of revenues, and that's what we did in H1, first of all, and moving to page 23, with asset management activity.

We are not a third-party manager, but we like to partner with institutional investors in order to manage risk, to accelerate growth, and to improve returns. Since the start of the company, we developed this model.

We now have 10 partners, institutional investors, in 31 JVs for a value externally owned of close to €9 billion. You see page 24 that this activity has created a recurring and a growing source of revenues over the years.

We expect for 2026 full year around €40 million of revenue, up by €7 million versus 2025. We are keen to continue to develop this activity as it is recurring source of revenue with long-term contract.

It enables us to limit the cash spending, and it's a diversified source of revenue with multiple of JVs and partners. Second source of ancillary revenues is related to development margin and fees, as you see page 25.

Development margin has been also a recurring source of revenue for Covivio despite its volatility. You see that on the slide, on average, €20 million over the years.

We have two kinds of development margins. The first one is build-to-sell program.

The second one is when we develop in JVs, such as for Thales in Vélizy. Covivio acts as a sole developer and takes the risk.

In exchange, we benefit from a development margin when the JV buys the project above the development cost paid by Covivio. It's also a diversified source of revenue for us thanks to projects that are in France, in Germany, in Italy, as well as in office, in hotel, and in residential.

You can see some example on the right part of the slide. This activity has grown significantly in H1 2026 with €26 million of margin booked, and we expect the total level of margin to reach €35 million for the full year.

Let me now move to the results and first to the adjusted EPRA earning, page 27. That leads to an increase by 7% year-on-year of our adjusted EPRA earnings at €282 million and €2.55 per share.

If we focus on the bridge on the slides, first of all, Suez departure for CB21 has reached its highest impact, negative impact, in the H1 2026, as we were still receiving the rents in H1 2025, and they paid, as I said before, an indemnity last June 2025. This explains the -€18 million you see.

This impact, more importantly, will progressively be reduced in the next quarters thanks to the good re-letting process of this tower. Secondly, the rental activity excluding CB21 has been very positive across the board as we have seen right before, and we recorded a +€12.7 million of revenues.

The rents of our companies accounted under equity methods brings €3 million of additional revenues as well. Asset management revenues are up by €5.7 million thanks to new JVs, and the results from other activities relates to property development margin and are up by €15 million.

In parallel, and again this year, our balance sheet has further improved in H1, as you see page 28. Lower LTV down to 38.6%, lower net debt-to-EBITDA down to 10.5 times.

We also kept a low cost of debt thanks to a debt which is hedged at 85%, and in this context, S&P has confirmed last April its BBB+ rating for Covivio. Finally, on the results, let's move to net asset value, growing by 1.6% for the NTA over the semester to €84.2 per share.

Bear in mind that the second dividend payment have been made last July 15. Thank you, and I now let the floor to Christophe.

Christophe Kullmann

Thank you, Paul. Let me now turn to our key strategic priorities for the months ahead.

First priority is to continue rebalancing the portfolio across our three asset classes and increase its centrality. In simple terms, more hotels, more Southern Europe hotel, more city-center office.

We are making good progress toward our 2030 target, with hotels now representing around 24% of the portfolio. At the same time, we continue to enhance centrality, with 73% of our offices located in city center and 92% of our hotels in top tourist destinations.

Another lever to increase our hotel exposure is office-to-hotel conversions. A good example is Voltaire, a newly committed project in central Paris which will transform an office asset into a 165-room, 5-star hotel complemented by a sports club.

Including our three other committed projects, our conversion pipeline now represents nearly 600 rooms with a target yield on capex of around 8%. As we work on the rebalancing of our portfolio, we remain equally focused on extracting value and growing profitability through active asset management.

This come with our value-add capex program in hotels, as shown on slide 35. As a reminder, we have identified 20 hotel redevelopment opportunities representing 12% of the portfolio.

With €400 million of capex, these projects should generate around €260 million of value creation and a 13% yield on capex. This should enable us to more than double EBITDA from €50 million today to €102 million by 2030.

On the next slide, you can see that we have accelerated the execution of this value-add program. Following the five projects launched in '25, we started eight additional projects in '26.

Beyond refurbishment work, several also include extensions or brand changes. We plan to launch three more projects in H2, bringing the total number of ongoing projects to 15.

All together, these projects represent €249 million of capex with a 13% target yield on capex. Another lever to enhance profitability and create value is active operator management.

In Germany, we have just renewed five management contracts and partnered with operators with strong track record, including Radisson and Odyssey. At the same time, we continue to expand Wojo, our in-house operating platform, which now manage 25 hotels and more than 3,400 rooms, representing around 10% of the portfolio.

These initiatives give us greater control over asset performance, improve operational efficiency, and support further EBITDA growth and value creation. Let me now turn to our office portfolio, where we continue to focus on enhancing quality, profitability, and value creation.

The first lever is the selective launch of developments in our strongest markets, Paris and Milan, all targeting yield on capex above 7%. The second lever is the value embedded in our land bank, notably at Symbiosis and Scalo di Porta Romana in Milan.

Together, these projects represent nearly 100,000 square meters for future development potential. In German resi, we continue to drive profitability through a combination of privatization and rental growth.

We are steadily expanding our privatization pipeline while maintaining attractive disposal yields below 3%. On the rental side, we continue to capture upside through indexation, strong reversion on the re-letting, selective modernization program, and supportive market fundamentals.

Let me now turn to our third strategic priority: scaling our ancillary revenue streams, which represent an additional source of recurring growth. The first lever is asset management.

We are benefiting from growing demand from institutional investors seeking for experienced partner with strong operating capabilities. With our track record and extensive network of partners, we are well-positioned to further scale this activity.

The second lever is development management. We have around 160,000 square meters of project to deliver by '29, which will generate attractive development margin.

Beyond that, our land bank provides more than 160,000 square meters of additional opportunities, creating further potential to partner with investors and generate revenue streams. Finally, our fourth priority is to develop hospitality-led services, building on our unique expertise in hotels and customer experience.

Our ambition is simple: transform our buildings into destinations that people actively choose, not just places where they work. A good example is CB21 in La Défense, where we are repositioning the assets around a hospitality-inspired experience, combining workspace, services, wellness, and events.

This approach enhance the attractiveness of our buildings, support occupancy and rental growth, but also strengthens tenant loyalty. At the same time, we are strengthening the appeal of our assets through targeted partnership and increasing revenues generated by our shared spaces operated by Wellio, our flexible office platform.

Finally, operated resi is an attractive growth opportunity supported by strong structural demand in Germany. Building of the success of Covivio to Share, which already manage 382 units, we are now scaling the platform through Null Drei Null Berlin, our flagship mixed-use project in Berlin.

With more than 300 operated apartments, Null Drei Null Berlin is another example of how we leverage our operating expertise to drive growth, profitability, and value creation. Before closing, let me briefly comment on the appointment we announced yesterday within our executive committee.

We are pleased to welcome Aude Grant back to Covivio. Aude brings deep expertise in the French office market and will lead our French office business.

Many of you already know Alexei Dal Pastro, who has successfully led our Italian and German office activity for several years. Together, Aude and Alexei will serve as Deputy CEOs and help drive the execution of our strategy.

I would also like to thank Olivier Estève for his outstanding contribution to Covivio during the last 24 years. Covivio is what it is today thanks to his strong contribution.

Let me briefly summarize the key message for this morning. H1 demonstrates the strength of our model.

We deliver solid operating performance across all asset classes, grew on our earnings and NAV, and continue to enhance portfolio quality, disciplined capital allocation. At the same time, we're executing on our strategic priority and unlocking new sources of growth through active asset management, ancillary revenues, and hospitality-led services.

With the solid first-half performance and clear strategic priorities ahead, we are confirming our '26 guidance of 4% growth in recurring net result per share. Thanks to all for your attention.

We are now happy, with Paul, but also with Olivier Estève and Tugdual Millet, to open the floor for questions.

Operator

We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press * and 1 on their telephone.

If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press * and 2. The first question comes from the line of Florent Laroche from ODDO BHF.

Please go ahead.

Florent Laroche

Hi, good morning, Christophe. Good morning, Paul.

Thank you for this presentation. I would have two questions if I may, and I can ask one by one.

The first one would be on the guidance. You have had a very strong H1 performance, and so you confirmed your guidance.

Why today plus 4% is a wide estimate for the year, and how this guidance could be a little bit conservative for H2?

Christophe Kullmann

Paul, on the guidance? Paul likes to speak on the guidance, you know that.

Paul Arkwright

Yes, hello, Florent. As you noticed, we recorded most of the promotion margin in H1.

That's the first element. I would say that we are well on track on this guidance.

It's fair to say that we are a bit conservative, but we also have the effect of short-term interest rate increase for the second part of the year. That's why, overall, we have maintained this guidance.

Florent Laroche

Thank you. Maybe my second question on acquisition opportunities for hotels.

We have seen that you have been very active in H1. What to expect for H2?

Are you looking for other acquisition opportunities, shall we expect something or maybe now it's for 2027?

Christophe Kullmann

Tugdual?

Tugdual Millet

No, I think we have started the year quite intensively and quite happy also of the attractiveness of the opportunity we have been able to size, and the idea is to continue with this trajectory, still focusing on best opportunities in Southern Europe, mostly lease, but also other opportunities through management. That could be also the other opportunities.

Continue with this objective to increase hotel exposure years after years.

Christophe Kullmann

Just to complete, we are currently studying new acquisition, mainly in Italy and Spain, so that's, I hope, we'll be able to complete in the second half.

Florent Laroche

Thank you. Thank you very much.

Operator

The next question comes from the line of Anand Aakanksha from Citi Group. Please go ahead.

Anand Aakanksha

Hi, good morning. Thank you for the presentation.

Two questions from my side, and I'll go one by one. The first one is just on the guidance again.

I see the negatives on the second half for the guidance are increase in finance expenses, low indexation, and the CB21 Suez departure. I think my question is, is it reasonable to assume that all these three drivers are going to have an equal negative impact on the second-half earnings, or could you just help us understand which is going to be the biggest driver and then which two are, kind of rate them if that makes sense?

Paul Arkwright

Hello, Anand. The CB21 effect should start to be positive actually in H2 thanks to the re-letting, huh?

Again, huh, we had in H1 2025 this one-off of this indemnity, we will not have again this negative effect in H2 2026, and on the opposite side, the fact that we re-let the full existing part, non-dev, of CB21, we start to have positive effect in H2. The main negative is increase of interest rates and lower property development margin in H2 versus H1.

Anand Aakanksha

Understood. Thank you.

The second question just on the portfolio split, pro forma hotels is about 24% at the moment as a share of the overall portfolio. Is it reasonable to assume that further growth from the 24% to 30%, we can expect it to be split broadly evenly between acquisitions and developments/refurbishment capex?

Could you just remind us of the returns profiles on each of these? What I'm trying to ask is, what are the acquisition yields?

What are the yield on capex or, just refurbishments? What the spread to the current refinancing rate is?

Paul Arkwright

You gave us you gave us a lot of figures in the presentation, but what in term of target, in term of acquisition yield, we are, on average, at 7%, including what is variable part of of the rent. That's that's what we achieve in in in '26 and what we would like to continue to have in the future also in in acquisition with some asset under management.

That's that's some things that you could keep as as a as a type of of value. In term of yield of capex, we give all the details in the presentation.

On average, we are close to 10%, what I can say, perhaps some sometimes above. On on hotel on office-to-hotel conversion, we are close to 7%.

That's that's that's the the yield on capex you could you could take into account in your assumption. To go to 1/3, the long-term target we have in term of exposure in in hotels, it will be be made like like like in this way, but also we we know that one way could be an increase in our exposure in our subsidiary.

We are continuing to discuss with some shareholder for that. Today, is not they are not willing to to move, but it could change in the future.

Anand Aakanksha

The spread to the current refinancing rates? The

Paul Arkwright

current refinancing today cost is... Oh, we are, let's say, around 3.6% on average.

Anand Aakanksha

Perfect. Thank you so much for taking my questions.

Paul Arkwright

Thank you.

Operator

The next question comes from the line of Ana Escalante from Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.

Ana Escalante

Hey, good morning. I have a couple of questions, please.

The first one is on the pre-letting of your pipeline. How is that progressing, especially for the deliveries that you have in 2026, which I believe is this asset in Paris?

Any visibility on 2027? Whether your conversation with tenants are being impacted by the ongoing uncertainty, and therefore they are taking longer to make decisions, or whether you think that the operating environment remains challenging and maybe the pre-lets will not progress as expected.

Any visibility or color on that would be appreciated.

Christophe Kullmann

Olivier?

Olivier Estève

I can give some color on the pipeline, office pipeline. We have a lot of pending discussion.

We're really optimistic on CB21, and that we consider we should reach 100% occupancy rate at the end of the year, of course, for a lease taking start in '27. I think we're really optimistic giving the discussion we are ongoing.

Also on Bèges, we have recently signed a new lease at €1,070 per square meter with incentive in the range of 16%. We see that the market is still positive as long as you are able to propose I would say the right product, meaning central office, as Christophe mentioned, but also with the right combo of quality, sustainability performance, and experience you are able to provide in the building, and exactly what we are doing in our offices, putting the stress on all the amenities and etc.

We have also another project under development, but the delivery is at the end of 2027. It's what we call Grand Boulevard, and also in this case, we are really optimistic on the development.

We have launched already in Milan the Vitae project with a significant level of pre-letting, more than 70%, and we are also pending discussion on other potential projects. I can say on the pipeline, really a good track record.

After the last, at least, but not last, Berlin, our project in Alexanderplatz. It's in this case, we have already 70% of the retail is pre-let.

We have let 100% on the residential parts, and we have launched the marketing on the office, and we have a really interesting pending discussion on 10,000 square meters on a couple of prospect on 1,000 to 3,000 square meters. Really a lot of traction also on this project, and with a market in Berlin on the letting side which is recovering.

Ana Escalante

Thank you very much. Then my second question is on your comments regarding the booking pattern that you've seen for the hotels after the outbreak of the Middle East conflict.

To what extent do you think that's going to generate a sustainable shift in demand because certain locations are no longer perceived as safe and therefore demand shifts towards other locations, or do you think this is just a one-off for 2026 and then in 2027 we will go back to pre-conflict patterns?

Tugdual Millet

We should reasonably expect that there is a bit of one-off in it, huh, because there is a replacement of kind of customer mix. That's why the figures that we show specifically in Italy and Spain is far more than what we have anticipated after probably more than three years of exceptional growth.

We should expect for next year a kind of softening effect if there is a normal world tomorrow, and so a bit of softening in this area. I have to say, as a reminder, the way we look at hospitality is at European level.

We are obviously looking at Spain and Italy today, but we all know that each countries benefit from different dynamic, and if there is a softening in Spain and Italy, we can also expect better figures for Germany and France next year.

Ana Escalante

Thank you.

Operator

Next question comes from the line of Martijn Kartman from Van Lanschot Kempen. Please go ahead.

Martijn Kartman

Good morning. Thank you for the presentation.

Three questions from my side. The first one is on slide 25.

You mention guidance of €35 million of development margins. Can you tell us how much of this is linked to the Vélizy?

Paul?

Paul Arkwright

Yes, hello. For obvious confidentiality reason with Thales, we don't give precise numbers, but what you can imagine that the growth of the development margin for this year is clearly coming from this project.

Martijn Kartman

Thank you very much. Then my second question on slide 24.

The asset management revenues make quite a significant jump, and could you give some color on the expected growth rate or ambitions for this income stream, maybe in a little bit longer term as well?

Paul Arkwright

As I said, huh, for us, it's a recurring source of results based off long-term contracts. Of course, in those contracts, we also have fees on asset management, on rents, etc., but we also have fees on asset rotation.

I would say that the target, first of all, is to continue to grow this number over the next years. Then we'll give you more details in early next year for the year 2027.

The target is really to pursuit this growth.

Martijn Kartman

Thanks very much. My last question is, how many divestments and investments are you currently in discussions for?

Can you provide any numbers on that?

Christophe Kullmann

As I have said initially, it's really the investment market is really quiet in '26 because of all what we see and what we have in mind in terms of environment. That's why we also decide to lower our investment program in this part because what is key for us is to keep our LTV under control.

I have to say we study a lot of acquisition in the hotel sector because that's where we would like to invest and so on. We have a really strong discipline in term of investment to reach our target in term of yield, but also to keep our LTV under control.

Today, in term of disposals, we want to push on disposal on non-core asset, where today is not easy to find buyers. That's why also we continue to imagine to have a soft amount of disposal in the second part of the year.

Martijn Kartman

Thank you very much. That was all.

Operator

Next question comes from the line of Marco Marti from Bank of America. Please go ahead.

Marco Marti

Thank you very much. Good morning, everyone.

I have two questions from my side. Number one is on Olivier Estève's departure.

Why his mandate has not been renewed? Was it his decision?

Was it your decision? Can we have some color on that?

How do you see the meaning of having two new deputy CEOs for the strategy of the company? What does it mean?

Christophe Kullmann

Thank you, Marco. I take it.

No, no, the decision was decision of the company. We are close to have the same age with Olivier.

I think it's important for a company to prepare the future. That was the decision taken by the board.

To renew myself and taking that into account to prepare the future on term of management of the company. Having that in mind, I proposed to the board the appointment of Aude Grant.

I know her for a while because she, as I said, she worked with us in the past. She have a really deep experience in office in France, also working in a European company with Colonial inside SFL.

I think it's really close to what we have, I'm sure she will contribute a lot for the future. Having two Deputy CEOs is also important for us because we are not a French company, we are a European company, and to appoint Alexei also as Deputy CEO in this environment is also the signal that we are working in this European field.

Alexei was really successful in the implementation of our strategy in Italy. Today, is also in charge of part of the German business.

I think it's really a key point of the strategy of Covivio for the future. Makes sense.

Marco Marti

The other one is slightly technical, that's for you, Paul, I guess. What are the main differences between your like-for-like number reported, which is for rental income, 2.2%, and the one of EPRA, which is 3%?

There is some gaps on every segment for hotels, resi, offices. Just trying to understand the biggest gap is in resi, I guess.

We're trying to understand what are the main differences here.

Paul Arkwright

The main difference is that the reported like-for-like is on gross revenues, whereas that for EPRA is on net revenues. As we have some, let's say, reduction of the net charges, it improves the like-for-like for the EPRA part.

Marco Marti

Okay. Brilliant.

Thank you very much.

Operator

As a reminder, if you wish to register for a question, please press * and 1 on your telephone. The next question comes from the line of Jonathan Kownator from Goldman Sachs.

Please go ahead.

Jonathan Kownator

Good morning. Thank you for taking my question.

Just on the German residential, there's a skew towards Hamburg and NRW in terms of like-for-like rent growth. Obviously, we've had the new Mietspiegel for Berlin.

Where do you expect like-for-like rent growth to trend going forward? Maybe also just to comment on the impact on valuation.

There seems to be a bit of yield expansion here. If you're able to comment, that would be great.

Thank you very much.

Christophe Kullmann

On the German resi market, first of all, what I think is really important is also this decision for the government to have to stop all this expropriation idea and so on. That's really a positive news for the market.

Nobody takes that into account, but it was a pending risk that was around us. Secondly, yes, this new Mietspiegel in Berlin is also positive for us.

We imagine that it will contribute by 1% in term of like-for-like in the future on top of the current evolution of the rent for Berlin. That's why we could expect a future growth of the like-for-like in the next quarter in term of German resi.

After that, the valuation put by the valuer, so that's something that we take into account as a external valuation.

Jonathan Kownator

How do you expect the investment market to trend given this latest news on Berlin? Are you already seeing any impact from that or any change in tone in terms of conversation?

Christophe Kullmann

Not yet, because it's too early. It was at the beginning of July, just two weeks ago.

I hope, yes, it will change the way. What is sure, just to be clear, you know that we have this two joint venture discussion with two French investors that want to go in Germany with us.

Just after this announcement, the boss comes to us and say, "Okay, now we can restart to look at investment." That's an example of immediate reaction for investors that were waiting since the beginning of the year to have a clear view on this potential evolution.

Jonathan Kownator

That's interesting. If I may, just one last one, an extension of that.

How are your negotiations with other JV partners? Are you finding more capital is interested in the space, or is it very difficult at this stage?

Christophe Kullmann

What is clear today, there is two aspects, especially for French investors. Insurance company raise a lot of equity in the first half.

All the insurance company really have a lot of equity because with the evolution of interest rates and so on, that's something which is positive for insurance. On the negative side, the fact that the country bond yield increased a lot is a negative compared to investment in the real estate sector.

What I can share is that since, I have to say, beginning of June, I have more discussion with those partners to work with them, to use the equity, to co-invest in new investment. It could be also for us a way to continue to increase our third-party asset management activity with new JVs, and we could do that both in resi, but also in hotels in the future.

Jonathan Kownator

Thank you.

Christophe Kullmann

Very helpful.

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question from the phone. I would now like to turn the conference back over to Christophe Kullmann.

Christophe Kullmann

Thank you, everybody, and hope to see you in the next days. Bye-bye.

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, the conference is now over. Thank you for participating in the conference.

You may now disconnect your lines. Goodbye.