Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you for being with us today.

Today is about three words: acceleration, profitability, and value creation. Everything we'll discuss this morning will connect back to these three priorities.

I'm Théodora Xu, Head of Investor Relations for Tikehau Capital, and I'm delighted to be hosting today's full-year results and strategic update. Today you will hear from our two co-founders, Antoine Flamarion and Mathieu Chabran; our Deputy CEOs, Henri Marcoux, Thomas Friedberger, and Maxime Laurent-Bellue; and our Group CFO, Vincent Picot.

A little bit of housekeeping element on the flow of this session. We'll first start with a look on Tikehau Capital key achievements for 2025, and then open the floor for a first session of Q&A dedicated to our annual results.

We'll then take a short break to allow everybody to refresh, to grab a coffee before moving into our strategic update. Then you'll hear first from Thomas, who will share his perspectives on opportunities shaping the next decade.

Then we'll have Maxime hosting a fireside chat with our co-founders discussing accelerating profitability across asset management. Then we'll have our co-founders and Henri provide insights on our evolving approach to balance sheet allocation before taking us through the harvesting phase Tikehau Capital is now entering, and providing more details on profitability drivers and value creation framework.

We'll then host a second session of Q&A dedicated to our strategic update. With that, it's my pleasure to welcome to the stage Mathieu Chabran, Co-Founder, for opening remarks.

Thank you. Thank you, Théo.

Welcome. Welcome everyone here in London, and welcome for all the people who dialed in on the webinar or the webcast.

I hope that you can hear us okay, you've got all the documents, and that you will be enjoying this presentation with us. Very happy to be back in London, not only for our 2025 full-year earnings, but also for this new Capital Market Day, as we call it, and very excited on behalf of all the team to host you at Tikehau and give you a little bit of the forward-looking, which is really what we would like to focus on today.

First, let's start with our '25 earnings that were released this morning. I like to call it a record year because the numbers stand.

Before we get into the numbers, I would like to tell you and witness how strongly the franchise has evolved over the past few years and the acceleration, as Théo was rightly saying, that we benefited from in 2025. It's been a record year on the deployment despite, if you look back and think about what 2025 was as a year and as markets to operate in, that was a record year on the deployment.

On the realization, we'll come back to that, on exiting some of our portfolio companies and distributing back to LPs, and as well as the fundraising, the gross and net inflows, we'll get back to that. We told you in 2022 that the focus was to develop, grow the profitability of the asset management.

Remember that when we went public nine years ago, we were barely doing €5 million of EBIT. It's close to €150 million this year, and you will see that this growth and expansion in asset management profitability is here to stand, and we'll give you some guidance where we think we can go.

Then finally, on the portfolio, we've got these two engines at Tikehau, right, the asset management, the principal, our balance sheet, we saw some strong contribution, albeit this year impacted by some forex, and we'll come back to that. As I was saying, record in deployment, realization, inflows.

On the deployment, it's €7.6 billion that we put at work at Tikehau, which is an increase of 35% compared to 2024. On the realization, on the exit, we like to say at Tikehau that you have to give back so that people keep giving.

You keep hearing about investors not getting money back. What we tried to do last year is to demonstrate that, yes, you can exit some portfolio company, give back to your investors so that that keeps fueling the next cycle of growth, and that was twice what we did in 2024.

On the capital formation, it's €10.5 billion of gross inflows, and that's the fourth year, fourth consecutive year of a record year in fundraising. It's a €8 billion in net inflows.

What we are very encouraged by is that the whole investments we made in the platform the past few years globally—remember we went public, we had five offices; when we saw you in 2022 for the Capital Market Day, we had seven offices; it's now 17 offices. We've got across the world, and from Asia, including Japan, Middle East, across Europe today, North America, even South America now, we've got all this new customer base that are fueling the fundraising at Tikehau.

So 80% last year came from new customer base, new geographies outside of our domestic market, taking our overall AUM to €52.8 billion. As I was saying, we've been focusing on larger transactions with a more global portfolio, not only in Europe, our domestic market, but in Asia, in North America.

That has enabled us to raise additionally more than a billion, €1.2 billion of co-investments on some of the larger transactions. You'll have some examples later on that you may have picked up over the past year, but that has been a strong driver.

On the capital formation, as I was saying, a few elements: In Asia and Middle East, it's a billion euro that was contributed. We hit the billion euro of inventories of clients in Korea that we had opened six years ago.

Just I'll leave you with an example that we kind of like. Just last year, out of the €10.5 billion gross inflow we had, four investors, four new investors actually, accounted for 20% of our fundraising, and they were all new relationships of ours, bigger commitment.

They came from some very complicated to penetrate markets. I'm thinking about Japan, thinking about Germany, I'm thinking about the US, I'm thinking about Middle East GCC, Abu Dhabi.

This is a strong illustration that the investment we made in the platform is now paying off, and we're harvesting all this investment that we had made. As I was saying, giving back capital to our LPs, it's €4.1 billion that we returned to our LPs last year.

Just as a data point, because people have been talking a lot about private equity last year, and I'm sure we'll have plenty of questions about private equity as well, and we're looking forward to addressing them, but it's a 2.6x that we returned to our investors on the realized transactions. Where does that leave us on the financial?

We issued this morning all the numbers in the details. We'd come back.

If I look at the first pillar of our business, our asset management business, it's a 8% growth of our revenues, converting into 18% growth at the EBIT level. We grew by 12% our core FRE, these fee-related earnings.

For the first time, as we told you a few years ago, we passed the 40% core FRE margin. You may have picked up, and we'll come back to that, that we're giving an improved guidance on this very important profitability element.

On the second pillar, the portfolio, it's a 19% growth in our realized revenue for the balance sheet, our investment portfolios, and a 33% revenue growth if we exclude once again these currency effects that Vincent will be detailing. Finally, it's a €136 million net income that we are reporting for 2025, which is 51% growth if you exclude this currency effect.

We propose a €0.80 dividend that will be voted at the next AGM. That's for the key element.

There'll be plenty of details on the session. Once again, thank you very much.

We look forward to an interactive session. Thank you, and I will hand over to Henri for more details.

Good morning, everyone. Thanks, Mathieu, for this introduction.

Let's jump into our asset management flywheel. Maybe we'll start with deployment.

As you have seen, deployment has clearly stepped up during the year '25. We reach €7.6 billion of deployments.

That's an additional €2 billion, 35% compared to the year '24. Starting with private equity, maybe, with €2 billion compared to €600 million the year before.

Clearly, we've accelerated deployment, notably on aerospace and defense, cybersecurity, decarbonization in Spain, Belgium, Germany, and in US through our flagship strategy, but as well through our co-investment vehicle. Real assets represented €1.4 billion of investments compared to €1 billion during the year '24.

Here again, discipline has remained paramount. We continue to focus on high-quality, well-located assets, notably to be noticed during the year '24, big residential portfolio units in France, as well as a big investment, first investment in real estate in the US, and notably several additional investments in the Netherlands.

As far as credit is concerned, so that's clearly a stable deployment versus '24. We are standing at €4 billion, very well diversified allocation through Spain, Italy, Netherlands, Belgium, UK.

Very strong momentum as well on our CLO issuance business. We are ending the year with more than €7.6 billion of dry powder end of '25 to be ready to capture new investment during the year '26.

We've been talking about executing larger transactions. That's a very key, important point that we wanted to mention today.

Out of these €7.6 billion of deployment during the year, we had €1.2 billion that were deployed through dedicated co-investment vehicles. That has been the case on the private equity business, such as the Egis transaction we've been commenting for a few months; AUSA in Spain; that has been the case for as well Sciensano aerospace and defense deal in Belgium; that has been the case as well for real assets through this residential deal; that has been the case as well for private debt, where we had several deals where we have welcomed co-investors.

That's clearly a new feature here creating adjacencies, creating new funds alongside our flagship and welcoming co-investors. What does that mean?

That means that through this creation of new vehicles, we are bringing into the platform additional fee-paying. Management fees that are going to fuel our fee-related earnings, and additional performance fees which will depend on the exits, of course, but which will fuel as well our asset management EBIT.

Looking at what happened in '25 over those co-investments, that's roughly more than €1.2 billion of additional co-investment bringing more than €150 million of asset management EBIT for the coming years. Realization: Clearly here once again a strong increase.

It's almost the double figure as what was exited in '24, reaching €4 billion of exits. Here again, private equity has been increasing significantly.

That's €1 billion of exits for five positions that were exited during the year reaching 2.6x of multiple. Clearly in line with our fund expectation.

As far as real assets is concerned, we remain stable, €500 million of exits. Multiple on real assets achieved has been 1.6 times.

That's at asset level, unlevered, and those exits are mainly residential and light industrial. As far as private credit is concerned, here clearly very strong increase.

Realizations have reached a record, that's almost €2.7 billion. As far as direct lending and corporate lending are concerned, those are repayments.

The average MoIC reached has been 1.4. As far as our special opportunities business is concerned here, we've been exiting several positions as well at our initiatives, achieving a gross MoIC of 1.6 times.

I want to insist on that because clearly, in '25, I think that the global macro environment as far as exits is concerned has been challenging. In that context, we've been able to deliver €4 billion of exits.

We are sending back money to our LP, we are increasing the DPI, which is key, we are increasing the performance, and all the average gross MoIC that have been realized on all of our exits are clearly either in line or above our fund expectation. Fundraising: Here again, we've been mentioning a €10.5 billion of gross inflows, record year.

As far as net inflows is concerned, that's €8 billion of net inflows, a 13% increase during the year. Looking at this fundraising a little bit more in detail, you can see that as far as private equity is concerned, we've reached €2 billion.

We'll come back on that. Notably, those inflows have been driven by the cybersecurity final close, regenerative agriculture as well.

Our specialist funds being decarbonization fund number two, aerospace and defense fund number two have been benefiting obviously from strong inflows in the current environment. As far as real asset is concerned here, it's a performance of €1.3 billion of net inflows focusing on value-add and core and core plus.

This is including the previous transaction I was mentioning, notably residential in France, the one in the Netherlands as well. Strong contribution from credit, €4.4 billion, stable versus last year.

As we've just announced a few days ago, we've been closing our credit secondary fund number two, $1 billion, which is almost double the size versus previous vintage. As far as direct lending vintage number six is concerned, which is still open as we speak, we are close to €5 billion.

Here we have secured the two largest individual LP commitment in our history from Germany and in US. Demand, as far as direct lending is concerned, remained quite strong.

As you can see over here, diversified strategy, larger tickets, co-investment, client convictions, bringing us into this record €8 billion for the year '25. Just a snapshot here on where we stand on our flagship.

I was mentioning special opportunity fund number vintage number three, €1.2 billion, which is almost the double versus the previous vintage. Credit secondary, $1 billion.

As far as private equity is concerned, regenerative agriculture vintage number one, €600 million. Cybersecurity fourth vintage, almost doubling the size versus the previous vintage.

As far as '26 is concerned, lots of ongoing fundraising as we speak. Obviously direct lending number six...

Can you hear me like that? Okay.

Obviously direct lending number six, still open as we speak, and benefiting from strong inflows. This year will be as well a strong year as far as private equity is concerned, we are still open during all the year, aerospace and defense fund number two and decarbonization fund number

two.

You have here on the screen the evolution of our AUM during the year. It started at end December '24 at €49 billion, ending at €52.8 billion.

Different movement of the year have been impacted by the inflows I was mentioning, €8 billion, and a distribution standing at €4.1 billion. You have on the right side of the page the diversified and complementary asset class, the split by business unit.

Thank you. We'll do like that, will be a bit easier.

Client base: As far as client base is concerned, one important feature, Mathieu was mentioning the number of offices we are operating, namely 17 offices as we speak. Important to notice that as far as inflows are concerned, that's more than 80% of net new money that has actually been raised from international clients.

You have here the biggest contributors for the year '25 being US investors, UK, Spain, Germany. To be noticed during the year '25, strong contribution from Asia, namely from Korea and Japan.

Korea has gone over the €2 billion mark for the year '25. Contribution as well from Israel, where we are approaching the €2 billion mark as far as LP commitments are concerned.

Those are the most represented nationalities in '25. On the right part of the page, you do have actually the split, which means that international clients have increased from 44% '24 to 46%.

That's a 13% increase representing €24 billion at end of '25. Private marketing is important feature.

We've been focusing significantly over the past year over this strong era of growth. That has been the case as well for '25.

That's 25% of third-party inflows that were raised through private clients. That's actually notably all the initiative we've been launching on private debt, private credit, unit-linked product have now reached more than €1.5 billion at end of December.

As far as AUM are concerned, that means private customer clients are now representing more than 34% of our AUM. That's actually more than €18 billion.

Two dedicated initiatives that have been launched during the year '25: one on private credit, namely TPPC, Tikehau European Private Credit, semi-liquid fund focusing on mid-sized European company; and second important initiative that was launched during the summer, which is a unit-linked dedicated to defense, security, aerospace. This unit-linked is currently distributed through partnerships that we are having with big insurance company.

We are currently standing over €200 million for this product, where the distribution has started end of '25, focusing on our aerospace and defense practice, and notably the track record that we are benefiting on that practice, aerospace and defense practice that was launched back in 2018. Last point on sustainability: A few years ago, we had set a target on AUM dedicated to climate and biodiversity.

Our target was to achieve at least €5 billion of AUM dedicated to that practice. End of '25, we are standing at €5.8 billion, notably thanks to our decarbonization practice, fund number two.

That means continued sustainability integration across the several pillars that we are benefiting through the whole platform. I will now leave the floor to Vincent for the financial review.

Thanks.

Thank you, Henri. I'll start the financial highlights with our fee-paying AUM and the revenue generation in terms of revenues.

First, fee-paying AUM grew by 6% compared to 2024. It was driven by net new money on our private equity practice, capital markets, and also by a very dynamic fundraising and deployment activity for direct lending and CLO business.

In addition, it's worth mentioning that future fee-paying AUM grew by 24%, and it was supported by solid net new money in direct lending strategies, which charge management fees on invested capital. Together, fee-paying AUM and future fee-paying AUM increased by 8% year-on-year, so that's a sign of securing future management fee generation.

Also, and the impact it has on management fees is that management fees increased by 8%, reaching €358 million. That's an acceleration that we have noticed specifically in H2.

Average revenue margin stood at 88 bps, which remains resilient, and worth noting that we record a performance-related earning level of €22 million, which is a record. On the following slide, a few data points on performance-related earnings.

At end 2025, AUM eligible to carried interest grew by 10% to €24.8 billion. In addition, at end September 2025, we had €220 million of unrealized performance-related revenues, which are actually accrued at fund level, and such level is based on the current performance at portfolio level.

This amount is not crystallized yet. It is not yet accounted for in our P&L, and it will be recognized as funds approach maturity.

In terms of asset management profitability, and as Mathieu mentioned, we grew our asset management EBIT by 18% year-over-year, reaching for the first time €150 million. This growth reflects specifically the increase in the core fee-related earnings, with a notable acceleration in H2.

This is mostly due to an increase in management fees in this period. Overall, core fee-related earnings increased to 41% in terms of margin, exceeding so for the first time the 40%, and it reached exactly 46% in H2.

Overall, and looking now at the cost base, we remained very disciplined because the operating cost base only grew by a mere 3% year-over-year, so that's a testament of an efficient resource allocation. Moving now to our investment portfolio.

At end 2025, the total fair value reached €4.4 billion, and still very granular, with a bit more than 300 investments. Approximately €3 billion of this amount is invested in our own management strategies, it ensures an alignment of interest with our client investors.

The remainder of this amount, €1.3 billion, is invested in our direct investment ecosystem, as you can see on the right-hand side. We've got a pretty well diversified portfolio in terms of asset classes.

Now looking at the flows and what happened over the year, investments reached €1.3 billion, of which €951 million of capital calls in our own strategies: CLO, credit secondaries, private equity strategies mostly. We also invested €370 million in our ecosystem, and it was mostly driven last year by our investment in Schroders.

Over 2025, we carried out close to €800 million of exits. Returns of capital were from various asset classes: CLOs, special opportunities, but also decarbonization and aerospace strategies that Henri mentioned when talking about distributions to our LPs.

Market effects: -€18 million, reflecting mixed effects, positive fair value changes for our Schroders stake, also positive revaluations in some of our private equity strategies, mostly aerospace and defense and also decarbonization, but it was offset by negative market effects in some very specific credit and real estate situations. Finally, currency effects amounted to -€161 million, and it's mostly linked to the sterling-euro exchange rate.

Next slide, in terms of portfolio revenues. In 2025, portfolio revenues reached €166 million.

That compares to €207 million in 2024. As mentioned also by Mathieu, realized revenues actually grew very significantly by 19% year-over-year, reaching €239 million, so that's worth highlighting.

It's composed primarily of coupon, dividend, and distribution from our whole spectrum of credit strategies, listed REITs, and also ecosystem investments. As regards unrealized revenue of -€73 million, we've got a P&L impact of foreign exchange for -€52 million, mostly linked to the euro-sterling exchange rate.

As I explained in the slide earlier, also around -€20 million of unrealized negative changes in fair value. Excluding currency effects, our portfolio revenues grew by 33% year-over-year.

If I have to wrap up our 2025 financial performance: strong performance in our asset management platform, as explained on the asset management EBIT growth. It was offset to some extent by currency effects and also by unrealized fair value changes on our investment portfolio.

Looking now in bit more detail, non-recurring item and other of €13 million, it's mostly linked to positive forex impacts on our US financings. Tax expenses, €51 million in 2025, in line with our net result before tax and a tax rate of around 25%.

Overall, our net result Group share announced to €136 million, and if we exclude main currency effects, our net result grew by 51% year-over-year. In terms of balance sheet metrics, our model is strong, supported by means of €3.1 billion of shareholders' equity, Group share, and also by short-term financial resources of €1.2 billion.

As regard our financial debt, which stood at €1.9 billion, it encompasses a €500 million new bond issue, a renewed and upsized RCF line of €1.15 billion, and at end of December 2025, we had drawn €150 million of our revolving credit facility. As of today, we have fully reimbursed our RCF.

Building on what I disclosed and building on our 2025 performance, we were also pleased to formulate a new 2026 vision that is disclosed on the screen, where we'll be laser-focused on reaching an AUM of at least €60 billion by end 2026, reaching a FRE between €175 million and €225 million, and a net result Group share between €420 million and €520 million, excluding forex effects. Worth noting that approximately €180 million of net result comes from the full disposal of our stake in Schroders that happened earlier this year.

Also, we also disclose a return on equity between 13% and 16%. All those metrics show improvement compared to 2025 and are above market expectations.

2026 has to be seen as a mere step in our journey towards a long-term profitable growth that will be disclosed and presented just after, and we will be providing, of course, more details on our targets later this morning. Thank you very much for your attention.

I will let Antoine for the concluding remarks.

Thank you, gentlemen, for this very thorough presentation. We'll now open the floor to questions.

If you'd like to ask a question, please raise your hand so we'll give you a mic. We will address in priority questions from the room, obviously, and also take questions from the webcast.

One question from Sharath Kumar from Deutsche Bank.

Good morning, all. Very impressive presentation, congratulations.

I have two questions, if that is okay. First one is while I totally understand your investment story, but I think it will be much simpler with an asset-light business.

Although I kind of understand where you're coming from in terms of your balance sheet funding your strategies, but ultimately I think it is very hard to deny that this has been hugely dilutive to your valuation. Has there been discussions to eye off the investment activity outside the listed entity so that it can improve your valuation?

That is the first one. I want to come back to the usual topic on your share price valuation, low free float.

A couple of years ago is when you disclosed your 2026 targets. At least on the asset management side, you have been mostly on track, while on the investment activity side is where I think consensus is widely divergent from your targets.

It's been a very painful wait for this sector to re-rate, and you have not been alone in that. When it comes to increasing the free float, what is the latest update that can give you?

I know it's been a chicken and egg situation for the valuation to increase or the free float to increase, but what is the latest update that we can hear? Thank you.

Thank you for your question. That's a usual relevant question we had on balance sheet and asset-light.

As you all know, we started the firm just as an investment company in 2004. In 2007, we launched the asset management, our asset management is 19 years old.

We are celebrating next year our 20-year anniversary for the asset management. We decided from day one that having a balance sheet will help fuel, grow the asset management.

As we discuss a little bit later during our strategic update, we'll be more precise into that. The truth is that we've been using the balance sheet to seed, sponsor new initiative.

Without the balance sheet, it would have been impossible to launch CLO in 2012, direct lending in 2009, Decarb in 2018, aerospace and defense in 2020. Needless to say that nobody will even answer our phone, we use the balance sheet to seed, sponsor that.

As a result, we have this balance sheet, a €5 billion balance sheet, and now a €53 billion AUM business. We are clearly unhappy with the valuation.

The sum of the part is miles away of what we should be. Clearly we don't get the credit of having both the balance sheet and the asset management.

For all of you who are very familiar, you just saw the latest M&A transaction announced, which is the Coller purchase for €3.2 billion. Coller is making €145 million of EBIT, let's say, we just announced €150 million.

That tells you more or less the valuation we should get on the asset management, and on top of that, we've got €3.1 billion of equity. We've been growing the firm using the balance sheet to seed, sponsor, launch new initiative.

As we enter now a new chapter, and we'll discuss that during the strategic update, we are committing less amounts to our funds. We don't really need now to seed, sponsor with large amount of money.

As you see, for the first year, in 2015, the commitment we had in our fund declined. We started the year with €1.6 billion of commitment in our fund; at the end of the year, it's €1.3 billion.

That's telling you that we don't really need as much capital as we needed before. Moving forward, we'll have really the two businesses: the principal investing, which will still remain invested in our funds, skin in the game is critical for us; and we have the asset management business, which is now profitable.

When we list the firm, if you remember, we were making €4 million EBIT, no profitability at all. In nine years, we grew from €4 million to €150 million.

As you saw on the 2026 guidance and vision, we are targeting between €175 million and €225 million of FRE. Now asset management is profitable.

The balance sheet we think is really back on track to be profitable. Vincent mentioned, for instance, Schroders.

We'll detail that, but Schroders has been a 64% IRR and a €240 million net income. That's why we are highly confident on the 2026 net income.

It is a very long answer to your question. People have very clear view on asset-light versus non-asset-light.

Blackstone is really asset-light, KKR is not asset-light. KKR is now compounding as a strong pace the balance sheet.

At the end of the day, for the shareholder, I think what matters the most is the net income. To increase the net income, having the two engines, the balance sheet and the asset management, will probably lead into more net income, more dividend, and share price appreciation at the end.

Thank you. Two more questions in the room from Arnaud from CIC.

Thank you.

Thank you. Three questions related to currency impact.

The first one is, can you give us the breakdown of your AUM by currency in order to forecast what could be currency impact on these assets? Then, do you intend to put in place any hedging policy?

I think all your debt is in euro, do you intend also on the liability side to have a diversification by currencies? The last one is regarding the net profit guidance for 2026.

Is it at constant currency, or do you make any assumption at this level?

Okay. Thank you for your questions.

As regards assets under management and the share in foreign currency, it's about 10% 10%, and mostly in US dollars. We're exposed to the US dollars around and through our US CLO and private debt strategies mostly.

As regard your question around hedging, we've got a hybrid approach at Tikehau. Like other actors in the sector, we have decided to put in place a natural hedging with a financing in dollars.

It's a $180 million US private placement put in place in 2022. We also put in place some forward contracts on our sterling exposure to some extent.

We've got this hybrid approach using these options at our hand. Regarding your last question around our 2026 guidance in terms of net result, which we mentioned is between €420 million to €550 million, we mentioned very specifically that it's excluding foreign impacts, basically at constant currency versus December 2025.

What we'll do moving forward when it comes to currency: When we have been issuing bonds, we've been initially only raising money denominated in euro. A few years ago, three years ago, we raised for the first time a USPP, dollar-denominated.

Moving forward, we will probably match our non-European currency exposure matching with the right liabilities, probably issuing more USPP rather than euro if we need. We consider that it's probably the best way to hedge, having a proper asset and liability match.

It costs less money, it's much more efficient. This hedging currency are always complex, because you can hedge the amount of money you invest.

Let's say you invest $100 million or £100 million, you hedge that, but if you end up making three-time multiple, having just the nominal hedge, your capital gain is not hedged. We think that moving forward, we're going to issue more in other currency, if I may say.

One question from Nicolas Vaysse from Exane BNP.

Good morning. Thank you for taking my question.

The first one is on Schroders. You have a big windfall coming your way, that's a great problem to have, right?

I'd like to know how you think about reallocating those proceeds between reinvestments or potentially payout to shareholders through share buybacks, exceptional dividends. Second question on your 2026 new FRE guidance: I'd like you to help us understand a bit how we bridge from where we are in '25 to get to the bottom end or even the top end of this guidance.

I'm wondering if you bake in some lumpier items like catch-up fees that you're expecting for this year, expecting some recovery at Sofidy the subscription fees because they're meaningfully accretive to the margin, and what you expect in terms of evolution of the cost base next year. Then finally, my third question: You mentioned some negative mark-to-market effects on the credit portfolio.

We've seen some of your peers actually suffering quite a bit. I'm interested in any comments about your credit portfolio, balance sheet exposure, how it's performing, and on the equity CLOs notably.

Thank you very much.

Thank you for your question. Maybe I take the first two one.

On reallocation or reinvestment, as mentioned before, we still have €1.3 billion of commitment into our funds. For instance, the Schroders proceeds is close to €600 million.

As Vincent mentioned, we reimbursed already our RCF, which was €150 million drawn, so that means that we have excess cash on the balance sheet. We're going to probably use that for our capital call, €1.3 billion, also it's over the next few years, it takes time.

We're going to continue to invest the balance sheet alongside our strategies, we have commitment in our funds, but the balance sheet is now doing two things: co-investing within our strategy, I suspect we're going to probably deploy more money into aerospace and defense where we are clearly ahead of the curve, same thing for Decarb, and we start seeing more and more credit opportunities as the cycle is becoming more complex. You probably read few days ago that we closed our second vintage of private debt above $1 billion, twice the previous vintage.

We are the only firm having such track record when it comes to secondary private debt, I suspect that we're going to allocate the balance sheet more into secondary private credit. Maybe I start on your question on 2026, and I will let Henri comment.

We have four metrics in our 2026: One is our return on equity between 13% and 16%, which is mid-teen, double-digit. As mentioned before, we are fairly convinced that we should reach between €420 million and €520 million of net income for 2026.

Part of that is obviously the Schroders disposal, and as disclosed in the market, we decided to sell in the market our stake rather than waiting the end of the offer, which could happen in Q4, but could happen maybe in Q1 2027, you never know. We are fairly convinced that we're going to reach this level of net income, and as a consequence, this return on equity.

Your question specifically on catch-up fees and FRE: We have several vintage of private equity currently raised, namely AAP 2, which is aerospace and defense, and Decarb 2. There is potentially a very large amount of catch-up fees, as stated in the bylaws.

Within this range of €175 million-€225 million, there is some amount of catch-up fees, and we are fairly convinced, when we look at our pipeline right now coming from LP, there is a very strong demand, obviously, for aerospace and defense, and there is still mainly European appetite for Decarb.

Maybe in summary on that, there are mainly three drivers on that. You may have seen that future fee-paying have been increasing significantly end of '25, all these future fee-paying will obviously be transformed into fee-paying when we will be deploying these funds.

This is the first driver for evolution of fee-related earnings in '26. Second one is a mix effect, obviously.

As just described on the pipeline within our funds, we are, as on the road investing and fundraising on our two bigger platform PE funds, namely Decarbonization Fund number two, Aerospace and Defense Fund number two. Yes, there will be catch-up fees, but maybe excluding even this catch-up fees, there's a mix effect with these two private equity funds and the track record we have been benefiting on these two areas.

Maybe the third driver to increase effectively the FRE in '26 is obviously cost control. We started to take carefully more the issue around cost already back in '25, and we will be keeping in that area for '26.

Go ahead, Mathieu.

No, I just wanted to address the third question on private credit. I wish we had two hours to discuss private credit, since so many things have been written over the past few weeks or a few months, but more specifically, we happen to have our CLO business within private credit, just to answer specifically on the US side, beyond the forex that Vincent elaborated on, obviously last year was a volatile year, and as the CLOs are some arbitrage vehicle with some liabilities issued and then can be reset, and so what we had last year was effectively on this specific part, some kind of a lag between the end of September, end of December valuation at the asset side and the reset on the refinancing.

We're expecting to catch up on this side when we reprice and reset the CLO. Now, more specifically on the private credit, as Antoine said, that's a big opportunity for secondary private debt, but we've never been as bullish on the opportunities to keep deploying with the same underwriting discipline when it comes to direct lending.

The issue we've been facing, there are two comments: One is cyclical, the other is structural. On the cyclical aspect, what we've experienced, particularly in the US, is this massive gross and fund raise on credit where many managers, and not being judgmental whatsoever, had to deploy zillions raised, and as when some of our competitors raise $50 billion a quarter, it takes some time to keep the same discipline underwriting, where still, and our partner Cécile is in the room, I think we're 5% to 7% selection rate on our private credit deployment.

That has been driven effectively a lot of talk around the direct lending. The other thing that in the US, the bulk of all the noise you've been hearing was coming from the US, you've got the mid-market direct lending, which is on average six to seven times now levered.

In Europe, it's more like 5 to 5.5. Our portfolio is 4.4.

As always on credit, because the only thing you're getting is par, it's how do you underwrite and how do you structure going in. It's a much more defensive portfolio that we've been having, and we just closed the sixth vintage of our strategy.

We started in 2007, it's a 19-years track record when, as I'm sure 90% of the private credit managers were launched post-GFC. We have our share of situation of negative watch where we're working.

A lot of the cyclical aspect is effectively all the credits that were originated in 2021, the zero interest rate environment, the central bank very accommodating policy, and when you had a base rate at zero and the spreads at 300, obviously fast-forward five years, you've got a base rate at four or five, and the spreads maybe at four or five, obviously, your cost of refinancing is much higher, and then you have to effectively recapitalize part of them. Now, the silver lining, as Antoine alluded to, is that we're entering the golden age of the secondary private credit, and we're best positioned to tackle that.

Thank you so much. I'm sorry, I'm conscious of time.

We'll address more questions later on during the second Q&A session. Let's take a short break.

We'll resume in 10 minutes. Thank you very much.

Welcome back, everyone. Before moving into the strategic update, we would like to take a few moments to step back and revisit who we are and how we have built our platform.

We're going to show you a short video that retraces our journey, highlighting the evolution of our platform and the areas of expertise that position us as a differentiated alternative asset management. Let's watch.

Tikehau, an island on the edge of the world, the promise of a great journey. It all started in 2004 with nothing but ambition and the desire to discover new paths in the world of investment.

Think big. At Tikehau Capital, we're not just alternative asset managers, we are explorers.

As we expanded our global presence, we continued to navigate the ship efficiently: curious, resolved, fiercely independent. To us, exploring is not about rushing or following trends.

It's about making informed decisions and heading in the right direction. We focus on four fields of expertise: private debt, real assets, private equity, and capital market strategies.

Together with our client investors, we share a common goal: to guide global savings towards sustainable financial solutions, towards uncharted territories. Create, don't compete.

Exploring is about creating a link, connecting the dots. Tikehau Capital relies on a global network of local talent, with nearly 50 nationalities spread across three continents.

Their extensive local experience allows us to keep our boots on the ground. Our thirst for discovery has led us to become forerunners in specific strategies, such as private debt or decarbonization.

We are pioneers. Investing is not about conquering, it's about supporting.

Supporting entrepreneurs to enable them to achieve their goals, because we are entrepreneurs at heart. We speak the same language.

Because we're on this journey together, we've chosen to align our interests with those of our client investors by investing alongside them. At Tikehau Capital, we share so much more than investments.

We share the same conviction, the conviction that with innovative solutions, we can create sustainable value and drive positive change for society. Continuously searching, understanding, and pursuing, this ongoing drive to discover uncharted territories is our oxygen.

At Tikehau Capital, our work is an endless exploration, and we are proud to lead the way.

We hope you enjoy this video that really captures our journey. Today is not only about looking back, it's about what our platform is capable of delivering.

We would like you to leave today's session with three key messages: First, we're exiting our build-out phase in asset management to move into a harvesting phase with accelerating profitability. Second, we're entering a new phase characterized by a greater strategic allocation of our balance sheet.

It has been used since IPO as a great growth enabler, and now, looking ahead, it will be used as a more strategic allocator. Finally, as Antoine mentioned a bit earlier, those two distinct and complementary growth engines will offer significant optionality for us to close the valuation gap and also maximize value creation for our shareholders.

Aligned with our 2026-2029 roadmap, we'll be focused on delivering the following objectives: First, deliver cumulative net inflows of over €34 billion, representing a 22% growth compared to the €28 billion we have raised over the last fundraising cycle. This is first one.

The second one is that we aim to generate core fee-related earnings margin of between 45% and 50% by 2029, compared to 41% achieved in '25. On top of those objectives, we have formulated two commitments.

Those are to maintain our investment grade rating and continue to distribute over 80% of our asset management EBIT to our shareholders. Now let's start with the first section of this new chapter.

Please join me in welcoming on stage Thomas Friedberger to share his perspective on opportunities shaping the next decade. Thank you.

Thomas, first question for you, and thank you for being here with us today. How would you characterize the evolution of global markets today, and what do you see as the most impactful trend shaping the industry today?

Thank you, Théo. If we look at the size of the private markets, they were estimated at $26 trillion in 2022.

They are expected to grow at $61 trillion in 2032. Those are not small numbers.

It's approximately 50% of the current global GDP. If you want to compare that to other markets, let's say you have a global market cap today in listed equities of $140 trillion.

This number of $61 trillion expected in a couple of years is not small at all. It means that the private markets are converging with liquid markets.

The convergence doesn't stop there. Let me take the example of private credit.

Private credit has converged in size with the high-yield corporate bond market and with the leveraged loan market, both in the US and in Europe. That's done already.

As a consequence, the fixed income markets are more and more integrated, with private credit spreading to investment grade, to asset-backed lending. This will offer a full range of new options to issuers going forward.

We also think that, by the way, having a strong expertise in liquid credit through our capital market strategies is a strong advantage in that perspective of convergence. I would also say that in a complex world where uncertainty, volatility, dispersion are increasing, where asset allocators need to deploy large amounts of capital on the back of a strong growth in savings, the one-stop-shop model is appealing.

Why? Because platforms benefit from clear processes, from clear risk management methodologies, compliance, conflict of interest management, better client servicing, better reporting capabilities.

Platforms also are able to source larger transactions, allowing co-investors to deploy large amounts of capital quickly. They also can afford the multi-local approach, which we think is absolutely essential in the generation of performance.

The message here is the convergence between public markets and private markets creates value. It creates value for companies and issuers.

The increase in deal size in private equity and private debt provide more options for companies issuing debt. They can allow a company to be taken private, for example, or to remain private for longer.

It also creates value for LPs. We said that it's allowing large asset allocators to deploy large amounts of capital in private markets.

It also gives access to private markets for private investors, which is kind of new. Also it will bring the best practice of liquid markets to the private markets in terms of conflict of interest management, reporting, and risk management.

All of that is positive.

Thank you, Thomas, for those very interesting insights. We've seen an increasing sophistication in private markets.

What investor behavior shifts are most material, and what capabilities must managers build to truly differentiate and capture growth?

If I start with the institutional world, we notice a sharp increase in demand for co-investments, for SMAs, for bespoke solutions. That requires from us robust origination capabilities.

Capability to originate locally, but at scale, which is the challenge; also, solid fund structuring and tailored-made solutions to address all the specific demand from all over the world; and also robust processes in terms of allocation, valuation, reporting. That's on the institutional side, and so hence the importance of the strength of the platform.

If I now go to the democratization of private assets, addressing private investors, it requires from us global distribution channels, the necessity to talk to a large number of distributors or global distributors all around the world, and also digitalization to deliver data-driven client experience and reporting, which we are addressing partially through our Opal platform.

As we look to the future now, what structural themes do you see defining the next decade, and where do you see the most compelling opportunities emerging?

Complex question to answer in a couple of minutes, but I'll try to do my best. There will be growth in 2026, 2027, but we have the conviction that this growth is going to be led by investment more than consumption.

CapEx-led growth, meaning that growth will be probably more concentrated on the sectors that are the priorities of the government, the famous 4Ds of McKinsey: decarbonization, defense, digitalization, deglobalization. We think that the growth will be concentrated with the companies able to enable this to happen.

The sellers of picks and shovels of the resilience, if you will. Aerospace and defense, energy transition, cybersecurity are among those sectors, and that's the reason why we are focusing on them.

Let me also consider deglobalization. There is a need in Europe to create European champions also at the SME level.

That is addressed through direct lending, because private equity players use three times more direct lending than capital markets or leveraged loans to finance those transactions. We think there is a strong opportunity also in European direct lending to build those European champions.

Number two, we think that the economic value creation in the world is switching from efficiency to resilience, and resilience has a cost: the cost of producing closer to the consumer, the cost of getting insurance against climate risk, against cyber risk, the cost of operating with higher equity buffers and less debt to cope with COVID-like situations, the cost of having more robust supply chains. We expect lower growth in the world with high growth concentrated on the sectors I mentioned.

It will also probably change the way to invest in private equity. Companies are becoming more asset-heavy than before.

Even in the tech sector, look at some companies now own data centers, they were asset-light before, they own data centers. Some of them are now building their own electricity production capabilities to feed those data centers.

It will be more asset-heavy. Probably that the way to invest in private equity will switch towards more what Warren Buffett was doing, which is invest in more asset-heavy sectors, looking more at return on invested capital.

It will not be easy because the best CapEx are done by the best management teams, but you can expect a lot of misallocation of capital also when there is a lot of CapEx in a sector. Probably less reliance on multiple expansion, and PE investors will need to use less leverage.

If you look at what we've been doing for the last 15 years at Tikehau, it's exactly that. We've invested in sectors that are more asset-heavy, aerospace and defense, for example, with less leverage than the average.

Third theme is we are entering into a war economy, which just doesn't mean hopefully that we will go to war, but which means that all economic agents are put at the service of the priorities of a given government. That means probably accommodative monetary policies going forward, starting probably in May in the US, but also massive fiscal expansion, which means probably lower short-term interest rates and higher long-term interest rates, steeper yield curve, which is good for banks, which drives the strong conviction that we've been having at Tikehau for years saying that we prefer credit risk to duration risk.

From that perspective, we think that direct lending, which is 100% floating rate, is very well adapted to this environment, but also, for example, short-duration credit in our credit capital markets activities. Last but not least, we think there is a strong opportunity in Europe because Europe is accumulating accommodative monetary policy, massive fiscal expansion in Germany, which will have consequences all over Europe, lower valuations compared to the US, lower levels of leverage in the corporate world, and the end of the deleveraging of southern European banks, which probably provides appetite to finance the economy from those banks not only in southern Europe, but in the whole of Europe.

A very benign investment environment despite all the European bashing that we see. With the condition of being disciplined, there is a very strong opportunity in Europe, where we deploy 80% of our AUMs right now.

Very insightful. Thank you, Thomas.

Last question: In that context, what are the implications for our different asset classes if we go through each of our strategies, and what aspects of our value proposition best position us to capture these opportunities?

Of course, it will be all about performance. Performance will drive fundraising, performance will be key.

For that, we will continue to rely on: one, local sourcing, which is absolutely essential to the generation of performance, but also in terms of risk management, addressing tricky situations locally; strong corporate culture of alignment of interest, and as such, strong investment discipline, which we think we have by DNA; and also partnerships to benefit from superior expertise and avoid crowded areas, partnership with corporates, partnership with partners in regions where we are less developed, with why not other asset managers. That's the create, don't compete angle of what we do.

Now in terms of opportunities, there are a lot. I will regroup them in three categories: growth, value, and niches.

In terms of growth, as I said, in private equity, the solution providers to the sovereignty, to the resilience will continue to experience strong growth in a world that will grow at a slower pace. Aerospace and defense and decarbonization are two strong convictions, and we are really confident there that by allocating our capital well, we can generate a lot of value for investors.

In liquid strategies, we are very excited by anything related to the building of European sovereignty, which is a theme which connects to what I just said on private equity. On European direct lending, of course, this opportunity to build European champions in a credit space that is growing and is growing also more towards larger cap financing with the condition, of course, to have the right allocation geographically and by sector, is also a strong growth opportunity.

Now value: Value being benefiting from low valuations, but also liquidity gaps. We think that here real estate is the obvious candidate both in equity and financing.

Very strong opportunity in real estate with depressed valuations and volumes that are starting to pick up. Private debt secondary is also addressing this opportunity, buying LP interest or GP and LP interest at a discount, being selective, is a strong opportunity.

Special situations, which we define as financing good companies or good assets with a bad capital structure, having a problem at a certain moment of their development, there is a lot of things to do in Europe. With regards to niches, I would mention financial subordinated bonds.

Those steep yield curves will continue to favor banks. It's a very European-centric opportunity, but we have a very strong expertise there in capital markets.

Asia credit is also something that we want to be involved in. We launched a fund recently, and we think it will be a high-growth area in the coming decades.

Okay. Very interesting discussion.

Thank you, Thomas, for your time. To explore these themes further, we'll now be joined on stage by our two co-founders and Maxime Laurent-Bellue, our Deputy CEO, for a fireside chat on accelerating growth across asset management.

Thank you, Thomas.

Good morning, everyone. Thanks for being here today.

It's a real pleasure for me to have this chat with our two co-founders gathered in the same place, which is not every day. Today we will talk about the firm, we'll talk about the industry, we'll talk about the perspective.

I want to start with Antoine, maybe, and I know Théo said that we would not do too much history and we'd rather look forward, but just a quick question to start. It's been a 20-years-plus entrepreneurial journey, which was quite incredible, and I must say I took part of a decent part of it, probably around 19 years today.

I've seen the firm changing, improving, growing from the startup I joined in '07 to a global asset management and investment company with 17 offices globally. Obviously a lot has happened.

Antoine, in your own words, I'd like to understand what are the sort of the key trends, or the key defining features that have been shaping our positioning.

Thank you, Max. Let's try to capture the secret sauce.

The truth is that, as all of there is no secret sauce. It's a lot of conviction, ambition, entrepreneurship, innovation, and maybe I start with that.

We are entrepreneurs. As Max said, as Théo said, the plan is to look forward for the next 20 years.

The truth is that we started, as with €4 million as real entrepreneurs, and the journey has been colorful, complex. There is not a single day when you have something new coming up: someone resigning, someone you're trying to hire, a deal going not in the right direction, a financing not in place at the right time, an historical shareholder willing to sell shares.

That's what's happening all the time. Because we are entrepreneurs, and I think a lot of people at the firm became entrepreneurs, maybe some in a different manner, but everybody is putting a lot of energy to make sure we keep the drive, we keep the energy, and we innovate all the time.

Financial industry is boring. As I keep saying, we used to have banks, insurance company.

Now one of the largest European financial institution is probably Revolut, if you look at least on the valuation, €75 billion. Now the banks are trading up, and you've got several banks above €100 billion market cap.

This is what's happening. Revolut was nowhere, and now it's €75 billion.

Everybody wants to make sure that they put their funds on the Revolut platform. As Thomas mentioned, we create our own digital platform called Opal.

It's been a record year last year, we sell Tikehau funds and other GP on the platform. It's a greenfield.

We started with zero. Hopefully in few years, it's going to be several billions.

We started that again from scratch. Part of the secret sauce has been innovation.

You can innovate in this boring industry either on the way you raise money or the way you invest. We discussed earlier, Mathieu mentioned secondary private credit.

We've been the first firm to launch secondary private credit in 2020 in the US. Secondary private equity was everywhere, but secondary private credit was really new.

Now we raise our second vintage. We are accelerating on this front.

We've been doing that all the time. When we launched direct lending in 2009 in Europe, it was popular and well-known in the US, but nobody was doing that in Europe.

Defense is a very good example, and I think there were a question online we did not answer earlier about the deal flow when it comes to aerospace and defense. It's multi-billions coming, and we launched that in 2020.

I think part of the journey, and I don't know if it's the success or not, but we've been innovating all the time, we're going to keep innovating, and you can innovate, as I said, on the asset or the liability side. When you partner with corporation, nobody in the industry has been partnering with corporation.

When it comes to aerospace and defense, you know our partners: Airbus, Dassault, Thales, Safran. They put money, they sit on some of the committee, they help us analyze some of the company, and as a result, since 2020, we own now 35 companies in the sector.

We exited already three of them, reaching on average 2.7x multiple. You partner with these guys, you're probably ahead of the curve.

When you launch Decarb with Total, and we launch already the second generation, again, you partner with Total, that's give you an edge of understanding the sector, the trend: Does it make sense to look at hydrogen? Yes, no.

Battery storage? Yes, no.

We've been doing that all the time. Max has been part of the team who, a few years ago, start investing and financing data center.

We've done that a while ago. We sold one in the Netherlands in December.

Because we are born in France, everybody know Mistral, the French AI company, we've been the one financing their data center. I think it's been all the time for more than 20 years, we're going to continue to innovate.

Hopefully, that will generate more businesses. We will create more partnership with financial institution, with corporation.

It's a very long answer because, as I said, there is no secret sauce. We are entrepreneur, we innovate, we keep the same pace.

As some of we put a lot of energy. We, being the 715 employee, are putting a lot of energy to make sure we make things happening.

That's going to be the same thing. If you look now for the next 20 years, now we have 17 offices, a very strong platform, a very talented pool of people, and we see a big acceleration coming.

It's interesting because innovation and partnerships have been at the foundation of our journey, and sort of interconnected together. Should we expect obviously more innovation and more partnership?

I think I don't know if it's good, but we always find Thomas mentioned niche, a very specific thing, because when we launched Decarb, it was a niche in Europe, frankly. When we launched aerospace and defense, now it's super popular, but it was not even a niche, it was nobody wanted to touch that.

I think we are looking all the time at what's happening in the financial service industry. We look at traditional asset manager, Schroders is a good example; we look at alternative asset manager; we look at insurance company; we look at digital company.

You could expect more innovation, more partnership, because that's how we build the firm. I think now the partnership we can achieve are probably much bigger in terms of size than what we've done before.

Thanks, Antoine. Mathieu, I'd like to move on the industry.

In the same period of time, obviously, the industry has transformed rapidly, tremendously. Thomas touched on the growth of the market, how the market and participants have been increasingly sophisticated, more players coming in, more competition, I guess, more strategies.

It's in constant movement. I'm not even mentioning the backdrop, which is obviously quite complex right now with geopolitics, tax, and so on and so on.

How do we prepare for the next growth phase of the firm in that context, and how do we define our approach in this fast-moving environment and fast-transforming industry? It's a long question, sorry.

It's a great question. Congratulations for coping 19 years with us.

I must say that I did not realize, but that certainly illustrate that it's an entrepreneurial and it's a people business journey. Think about where we started and when you joined us in 2007, I don't even think that alternative asset management was defined as a term.

We barely talked about private credit that really was born on the ashes of the GFC, certainly in Europe. We were still very much in the GP/LP world.

Particularly, we were born in Europe, as Antoine said, not to mention France. The market was extremely defined.

It was the GP/LP, you were doing mid-market, European buyout. We were barely talking about private credit, as I said.

You had some real estate managers for sure, but even real estate was not really perceived as I think an alternative asset class. That was probably certainly in Europe the most advanced and most developed asset class that people could address, and not to mention infrastructure, etc.

Fast-forward, 2026, the name of the game, every day you read in the press, you see in the media, are these juggernaut platforms. I can name them because they've been modeled in our development, the Blackstones, the Apollos, the KKRs, managing more than a trillion.

We like to use this anecdote with Antoine: When we started in 2004 Tikehau with €4 million of asset under management, Blackstone was managing $40 billion. He was sitting at Goldman Sachs, I was at Merrill Lynch over there, and we were, "Wow, $40 billion."

Fast-forward, today, it's a trillion five, trillion six, the gathering or something, and it's only starting. This transformation of the industry, and which has accelerated over the past five years, it's complicated to date that, but you see that there is this massive transformation of increased savings, on the one hand: private savings, bank, insurance; regulation, which is now very different in Europe than it is in the US; interest rates structural in some part of the world, I can think of Japan, I can think of others; and this globalization phase, which all of a sudden enter a deglobalization phase, because maybe there is this cyclical moment with the US, where you're constantly on the hedge.

It's like being on a rugby playfield, right, and waiting for the information and seeing where the ball is going to be coming from, where are we going to have to play defense, to play attack. That has been extremely exciting as far as I am concerned, we are concerned, and we've only been able to do that because we were lean, agile, that obviously our team, our people were fully embarked in this dynamic.

That's why I am, certainly, I guess we are, Antoine, excited about what's ahead, because I can tell you that when people ask us, "What have you done differently?" Maybe starting with €50 billion and not €4 million, with 17 offices and not just sitting in our cellar in Paris.

We're at this crossroad now where we can tackle an industry that has been, as we said, changing dramatically, which has, I must say, has been somehow dominated by American brands, platform, franchise, which once again I respect greatly, but the world is in a different place now. I think you cannot have some limitation on goods with tariffs, you cannot have some limitation on people movement with immigration, and not have at some point some limitation on the most liquid assets, which is capital.

What we're seeing right now, which is rightly the point that Thomas made about sovereignty and the real defining investment that need to happen right now, there would be a massive opportunity for platform like us. We've been saying all along that you have to be multi-local, which means that when you're addressing Europe, and we're all sitting in London today, but I can see in the room many people coming from different places, and we all know that doing business in Madrid, in Milan, in Frankfurt, in Paris, in London, it's different.

The culture is different, the legal environment is different, the networks are different. We've been making this investment for the past 20 years.

When we're talking about harvesting, that's what we are referring to, is that Tikehau today is deeply rooted in every single market to be able to seize, to execute, to monitor, to sometimes to restructure those situation. That's what investors, or certainly the 80% of the investors we've been referring to that we are now trusting us, that's what they are looking for.

I'll give you an anecdote. When we started talking to Korean investors seven years ago, and you spent a lot of time there, we all spent a lot of time there, I remember seven years ago that some of them in our direct lending, for example, strategy, they were asking specifically to carve out Spain and Italy because back then we were coming out of the euro crisis, the pigs, the whatever.

Over the past 12 months, all the capital we raised in the region has been for private equity investment in Madrid and in Milan. Because it's moving so fast.

What those people are expecting from us is to be the local guide with the skin in the game, not just selling them the product of the month, but effectively promoting some investment strategy where there are some strong conviction at heart, but with capital aligned to them. Here again, a long answer, but I've never been as excited, because the platform we have to tackle this new chapter in the market, where effectively there is a dominant, like in many other sectors by some of our US friends, there is this I guess once-in-a-lifetime for us opportunity to be this next-gen, native European alternative asset managers, which has grown organically across asset classes with capital fully aligned.

We might discuss later on M&A or something, but not trying to build artificially a one-size-fits-all platform, but to have a real bespoke and hopefully relevant performing, as Thomas said, offering for those investors. Long answer, but I think that's why we wanted to have this discussion with you now, because I think the platform now is mature to be harvesting these opportunities.

Thanks, Mathieu. Shorter question now for Antoine, maybe.

I think we've sort of outlined a bit of the roadmap for the next few years earlier today. I want to be very specific, Antoine, on if you could elaborate on our key priorities.

We've mentioned scale, we've mentioned profitability, I'm sure underwriting is one of them as well, but could you give us your vision on that?

Thanks, Max. Maybe I will start using what Mathieu described as harvesting.

We've been investing for the last 20 years building the platform, and we consider that the platform, which is multi-local, 17 countries, strong local investment team, is fairly unique, meaning that we can source a lot of local opportunities. When it comes to private assets, you're not buying assets behind your Bloomberg.

You need to be local. We started doing, I don't know, a lot of residential, for instance, in Portugal, in Spain, in Germany.

As real estate market is very difficult. Now we start seeing really big guys, almost all the sovereign wealth fund, coming knocking at the door to say, "We want to co-invest with you in your residential expertise."

I think that's exactly the illustration of harvesting. We invest in the platform, we can source fairly unique asset with a very strong risk-reward profile, and that's about now the time to make sure we deliver larger transaction, we keep the same investment discipline, and at the end of the day, it's not about growing the AUM.

The most important thing is making sure you deliver performance for your LP, for your investor, and as a consequence, for the balance sheet and your shareholder. I think now, for this chapter, we're going to be focusing on more profitability at the fund level, at the firm level, because we've been investing for 20 years.

Now the operating leverage is much higher. We reach €150 million of EBIT, 19 years after launching the asset management.

The asset management has been launched in 2007. After 19 years, now we reach €150 million, and it's exponential.

I think now it's about time to harvest, to make sure we increase the profitability. We need to be very selective in a very changing world.

The example of Mathieu is clearly what's happening. Seven years ago, people will tell you, "Oh, please, no Spain, no Italy."

Now people will tell you, "You're doing too much France, we want to do really Italy and Spain." It's changing all the time.

When it comes to real estate, people have been obsessed by buying retail real estate, office real estate. Needless to say what's the office market looks like now.

We need to continue to adapt. I would set, to answer and summarize what I said: scale, operating leverage, profitability, investment discipline, and keep the same ambition.

That's the plan.

What about M&A, Mathieu? As we discussed, we are well-capitalized, we are potential buyer for not anything, but for many objects.

The industry has been consolidating recently. How do you think we'll be active, and how do we assess the right match, essentially?

Yeah. That goes back to what we were saying.

There is this imperative of scale right now, be in terms of footprint, size, assets and strategies platform. Whilst there will always be the great and perfect investors very focused, either locally or by industry, clearly the trend that we've been seeing over the past few years is accelerating, and I think we'll be even more impacted by the cost of doing business, be from a regulation standpoint, from as I said, the footprint you need to have.

We are very well-positioned. It's going back to some of the questions we had earlier on about the balance sheet.

The balance sheet has been a huge enabler for the asset management business, as Antoine addressed. It's always been, as entrepreneur, you're never overcapitalized.

It's quite often very the opposite. Having this opportunity to be able to buy, seed, merge, sponsor, we've become the partner of choice for many bankers, some of you in the room, and I like to call on you to give you some evidence.

I think today we've got 85 names in our spreadsheet, in the pipeline of situations that we are looking at: small, single-strategy, single-country platform, all the way to some of the large platforms that traded recently, and who have become partners of choice because of this balance sheet. If people just want to sell, cash in, and move on, that's not the type of things we're looking at.

People who say, "Okay, now we need to have a stronger partner that can seed, anchor the next phase of fundraising, the next fund, to be fully aligned in the mindset and the culture, and see the cross-synergy we can have in the distribution," then the discussion becomes highly interesting. Obviously, I think the first and foremost is the cultural fit.

I think it goes past the financial merit. Now that we are five, seven years into some structuring M&A, I think that some of them will demonstrate that the cultural fit was not there, and there could be some issue there.

I will always put culture first. Then it has to be about the complementarity, obviously, because there will be little merits for us to be doubling up on some strategies where we are already a market leader in a market or in a strategy.

Then it has to be financially accretive, right? The last thing we want to become is an asset aggregator, because that comes back to the discussion we were having about our earnings.

It has to be a profitable growth. That when you put all that as a filter, from 100, it gets you maybe 10 situations, right?

From 10 situations, there's maybe only three you want to do, and maybe one that will conclude. We believe that, as a general comment, M&A will keep developing, certainly in Europe, where some platforms are subscale, partly for some investors.

We also discussed the fact that many asset owners, they're reducing the number of relationships they're working with, but they're increasing the amount of capital they're allocating to. That's something that we can benefit from now that we are at scale.

The other thing, I don't think we commented on this KPI, and Vincent, tell me if I'm off-piste here, but I think we're still at two-thirds of our investors, LPs, are invested in more than two strategies. They will be into credit and private equity, into infrastructure and real estate.

That's something, this cross-selling and the upscaling that you can have with your LP, that's why you can make obviously a big difference. It's about being very selective.

On that, Mathieu, I was actually thinking probably even more selective than in any of our strategy, right? Because you certainly don't want to mis-underwrite an investment in credit, in PE, real estate, but you for sure don't want to mis-underwrite an M&A opportunity, right?

Because...

No, 100%. 100%, it's a people business.

You have not seen us entering into transformative M&A that, with all due respect for my investment banker friends in the room, what I call sometimes the banker's idea, which is on paper on Excel, it's always perfect. It always works on Excel.

Then you've got this people business component that needs to be factored in. As the industry mature, as some people get into some succession challenges, as some platform may be struggling to raise the next fund, those discussions are becoming very interesting.

Maybe I'm adding a comment on M&A. All the transactions you've seen in the sector, all the comments are about how many times, what's the multiple on FRE, okay?

BlackRock is buying HPS on whatever, 17 times; Coller has been purchased on 17 times, and so on and so on. Our view is that we should be focusing on the underlying fund, and not the FRE multiple at the management company at the GP, because at the end of the day, the value of an asset management business is the underlying performance.

I think people have been a little bit distracted in the last 15 years, people have been buying a lot. As you noticed, we bought nothing.

We are in a position whereby we will be the one consolidating, but as long as we make sure that we are buying very strong team, the same DNA and culture, and very strong performances at the fund level, because if you start having good performances, the value of your business is probably close to zero. We're going to remain disciplined.

We look at a lot of situations, and thanks to the balance sheet and our shareholder base, we can, if we want, if it makes sense, be acquisitive, but no doubt that we're going to be very, very cautious. We start seeing more and more opportunities coming, and as the cycle change, which is the case, for instance, in private credit in the US, there are more and more people looking at the door.

We are really well-positioned if we want, if it makes sense.

An extension to your question, Max, is it doesn't just have to be an M&A deal. It can be all these partnerships where we've been, as Antoine pointed out, I think pretty good at, with some corporates, with some financial partners, with some asset managers.

I think that that's going to be increasing. When we were detailing the fact that, moving forward, you have this asset management pillar, this balance sheet pillar, on the asset management level, we become a partner of choice for those partnerships, partly with more traditional insurance companies, I can think of, with some other asset owners who are looking for some ways to deploy more into certain strategies.

That's also a step forward where our track record of having this partnership will certainly resonate well at this time in the cycle.

Thanks. I'm conscious of time, maybe before wrapping up, two final questions, one each.

Maybe starting with Mathieu: What would you like to preserve the most, or what would you like to never change within the firm, regardless of where we go, how we grow?

Yeah. Théo put this little movie there, and obviously we're in a particular seat, Antoine and I, because it was the two of us, and now it's 700-plus people we are working with.

It was in a small office in Paris, and now we're on the road all the time meeting with all our teams and colleagues and partners locally. I think it's close to 50 nationalities we've got across the platform now.

I no longer want to use the word DNA, but I think this culture, this singularity that we try to develop over the years and still maintain, that makes effectively hopefully a small difference between similar platforms, is certainly what we need to be focusing on. When I look at the breadth, the expertise, the wealth of the people working around us, that makes a huge difference, because at the end of the day, as Antoine said, what we do is not rocket science, but for as long as you're fully aligned, that you are fully embarked in terms of the people that are working, then you can make effectively a difference between good and bad times.

You will know very, very well, you personally and many of our people, that sometimes sitting at an investment committee, sometimes we don't even have to talk, looking at each other people, because having been through all these cycles together, and that might be the benefit of now time and experience, it makes a huge difference in the way you're approaching what is at core, as Antoine said, the investment, the risk underwriting, the fact not to be forced doing something, each time we did something wrong was when we got a little bit into the FOMO. For as long as you can resist that, because the people, we've been in the locker room together, we've been on the pitch together, we had the fight, the win, the losses sometimes, but we came back, that's what we need to preserve, for sure.

Is it difficult sometimes?

For sure. For sure, I said.

To combine ambition, growth with maintaining entrepreneurial spirit, nimbleness?

Just to share maybe with the audience. Where I'm really, really happy is that today our senior leadership team, our partners, they're spread across all our offices.

From Singapore to New York, obviously here in London, and that is something that has also been a key differentiating aspect where you need to obviously hire locally, but you need to maintain this backbone, what is the culture of Tikehau, and hopefully the discipline, too.

Antoine, you opened, you close. Any key message, any key commitment maybe for our partner, shareholders, investors?

Talking about commitment, we've been committed to this business with our 715 people. We are very committed, we remain entrepreneurs.

Mathieu mentioned DNA. It's still the same company with the same drive, the same energy, a more global platform, a longer track record, because when you start, you have not a real track record, now we can claim that in several strategies, we have a strong track record, solid track record.

The world is becoming more and more complex, and we mentioned sovereignty, technological changes, geopolitics, politics. It's going to continue to be like that, we're going to keep diversifying our business from a geographical point of view, from a sector point of view.

We need to adapt the firm. I mentioned Revolut, our own platform, Opal.

We launched several initiatives called either Retina or Lagoon, which is our own AI tools. We need to adapt all the time, because we are not really AI or tech-native, we had to spend times.

We hire younger people specialized in this area. It's going to be the same, we still have a lot of appetite.

We're not going to do stupid things. We discussed briefly M&A.

We've got very strong conviction globally. We could be, and I don't want to be arrogant, but we could be discussing US asset management for two hours.

He's there, we spend a lot of time there. I'm not telling you that we are announcing in the next 10 minutes something in the US, but we are looking at all of our options.

We've got these two very solid businesses: the balance sheet with permanent capital that everybody is looking at. 10 years ago, you talk to some people in the GP industry, they say, "Oh, we're going to enter permanent capital," and we said, "We have €5 billion balance sheet, and we've got this now profitable asset manager."

We're going to have the two businesses, making sure they are both highly profitable, and we're going to keep doing the same thing with the same drive, same energy, with a very strong group of talent, people internally, and a very, and I finish here, a very unique set of partners: corporate partners, financial partners. We did not really discuss today, but as some of the largest families around the globe are invested with us: from the US, from Greece, from France, from Italy, from Netherlands.

That's also part of our cloud. More or less the same, with a little bit of new innovation coming.

23 seconds over time, I think that's fine. Thank you so much.

Thanks, Max.

Thank you.

Thank you very much, gentlemen, for this very interesting insight. Before delving into our final sections, beyond strategy and expertise, what truly defines us is the way we operate.

Our entrepreneurial spirit is not confined to our offices. It shapes how we think, how we collaborate, and how we challenge ourselves.

We'd like now to share a short video that captures this spirit in action.

It's great to have everybody back. It's the 10th anniversary.

We want it to be as inclusive as possible. Having all our clients, partners, and team together is what make this Ventoux event the best get-together every year.

I think it's important to have fun when you build a business, whatever you're doing, it's really important to have fun, and that's how, at the end, you're successful. To climb the Ventoux, you have to train yourself because it's really hard, and it never stop.

I think that I have watched the great ascents of the Tour de France, and one understands that fantastic experience. Although I'm an aging amateur, the chance to go and climb something like that, and hopefully summit it in a terrific environment with a great team, will be something I'll be very happy to have said I've done, and I probably will tell a few people.

The UAE is very flat, I was challenged by the mountain and Mont Ventoux. I've never been there, but they say it's the most scenic mountain in France, I'm very excited.

Because of the spirit that Mathieu and Antoine put into this event, you're willing to make the effort, you're willing to come, because you know that you're going to be participating into a real collective and group activity. Woo!

Amazing! Let's do it again!

When you think about investments or when you think by cycling, there are some similar values about it. It's a tough sport.

It's very hard. You suffer, you need to train, you need to have discipline, and also you get a lot of pleasure.

You are proud of yourself when you manage to achieve something, and you share that experience with people. I think doing this challenge with external partners and friends help building better relationship with them and for the firm, because it creates long-standing relationship of trust, of fun, of challenging and pushing yourself.

It's all about what we want to push forward at Tikehau Capital.

We just do cycling. FRE, net income, that's the real Tikehau.

It's a cycling and sports company.

Just got down from my bicycle, so... Good morning again.

We'll be finalizing this presentation starting with maybe a quick introduction in term of compounding effect and velocity focus. We wanted to remind you a few data points.

First one, there was a question earlier this morning on our balance sheet, asset-light. We wanted to remind you a little bit the way we've been using our balance sheet, how have we been operating over the last years.

Here, quick snapshot once again on our investment portfolio. Few takeaways: First one, significant increase of our investment portfolio, went up from €1.6 billion back in 2017 to €4.4 billion as we speak.

Second takeaway, the way we've been rebalancing this investment portfolio: Earlier back in 2017, they allocated 33% through our strategies. It has gone up roughly to 80% in '23.

End of '25, the allocation to our own strategy stands at 69%. That's actually a direction we want to keep on going, which means actually having lower intensive allocation to our investment strategies.

What have we been doing with our balance sheet? Few examples have been given this morning, but obviously, investment in our own strategy, we've been mentioning that.

We put our own capital at work, we invest alongside our LP, alongside our partner. That enables us to effectively have a compounding third-party fundraising, accelerate international expansion.

On the other way, investment in our ecosystem, as we've been doing in the past, to forge partnership, complement our expertise, and structure co-investment. We'll be coming back on the two first pillars.

First one, Tikehau Capital strategies: €4.3 billion have been committed in our own strategy. As you can see, credit has represented most of this allocation up until now, 48%, out of that 18% in our CLO platform, which, by the way, has enabled us to launch effectively 24 European and US CLO since we started the business; alongside that, launch as well vintage and new flagship, and adjacencies.

Another 17% of allocation has been done through real estate, and a significant part of our allocation of this 4.3 has been carried out in private equity, roughly 36%. All the initiatives that we've been talking about up until this morning, decarbonization, cybersecurity, aerospace and defense, all these initiatives that were launched back in 2018 have been done thanks to the allocation initially made by the balance sheet.

One important point, we've been talking about this kind of third-party fundraising compounder. As you can see here, each time from 2018 to 2021 that we were putting €1 from the balance sheet, we had a kind of multiple of by seven of third-party inflows.

Since '22, during the latest fundraising cycle, from '22 to '25, this multiple has increased to 13. Several aspects to that: First, it's true that once the flagship are becoming bigger, once vintage are more advanced, for example, which is the case on vintage number six on direct lending, the multiple is higher.

Clearly, we've been demonstrating that this fundraising compounding effect was very efficient. Other key priorities already that was announced this morning as well of co-investment: The use of the balance sheet is a key asset for effectively this co-investment opportunity.

We are using the balance sheet to warehouse partially some of this co-investment. That was the case back in '22 on this first private debt secondary initiative, more than €500 million.

It has been the case last year on several co-investment deals in real estate, in private equity, in private debt. We mentioned the deal in Spain, AUSA.

Here clearly you can see that this warehousing capacity and use of the balance sheet is clearly playing a strong role in our business model. Now switching to ecosystem and direct investment, I won't come back, won't be long on that, €1.4 billion, but once again here it's a kind of full ecosystem, which clearly this full network is expanding deal flow, it is deepening expertise, and it is clearly enhancing market intelligence.

We are partnering here with 56 GPs, 60 LP interest, and it's providing a huge diversity around investment type, geographical reach, of sector coverage. Antoine, you want to provide a comment on that as far as our GP relationship are concerned?

Thank you, Henri. One thing we try to do is build relationship around the globe, and long-term relationship across asset classes, geographies, sectors.

We've been using this balance sheet in what we call ecosystem to generate opportunities. It could be co-investment opportunities when it comes to private equity, to private debt, to real estate.

It could be financing. You've got two example here: We co-invested five times with J.C.

Flowers doing financial services all around the globe. For instance, when they invested into BTG Pactual a while ago when the bank was private in Brazil, we co-invested with them alongside GIC.

More recently, we invested with them in Jefferson Capital, who just conducted an IPO, and for us, it's a two-time realization, but the multiple is close to eight times now after the IPO. We generate within our ecosystem long-term relationship with families, with financial institutions, with very strong GPs.

That's part also of what I described earlier as the cloud. Tikehau is not only 17 countries, 715 people, it's several families, several really big and smart investors.

I think we're going to keep doing that. That will generate more opportunities, and also that's avoid you to do mistakes.

When you partner with some of the smartest investors in the financial service sector, it could be Flowers, but we've done things with Stone Point, which is the other big investor in the financial industry in the US, then you're a little bit smarter if you look at a leasing company, at a private equity company, at an insurance company, and so on and so on. That's really illustrate the DNA of Tikehau.

It's not only one firm, one culture, one P&L, it's a cloud of partners all around the globe, which enable you to find smarter opportunities, avoid mistake, and accelerate when it's time to accelerate.

What's the takeaway, you're going to tell me? Here we've provided a few data points, both from listed ecosystem investments, realized proceeds are amounting above €1.5 billion, net MoIC 1.4, that's a 13.2% net IRR.

As far as exited investment on co-investments are concerned, that's more than €270 million of realized profits and a 2.3 net MoIC. Once again here, quite demonstration of what we've been achieving over the last cycles have clearly demonstrated strong returns within our business model.

You want to provide a comment, or we can...

No, we had the opportunity to discuss a little bit earlier our investment in Schroders. As we've been using our balance sheet to invest in the financial services.

Back in 2012, we bought Salvepar from Société Générale. In 2017, we were the second-largest shareholder of Eurazeo with a 9.5%.

We are always screening the entire financial services industry. When it comes to Schroders, which was the best name in the City of London, with a very unique business, size, very strong track record, the company has been under some pressure, and as a consequence, valuation was very bad.

We decided to do two things: one, to become a relevant shareholder owning more than 5.4% of Schroders, but also building a relationship with them, trying to be able to create product, increase our distribution channel, and we are still discussing with them on opportunities. Suddenly a US investor came almost two years after we made the initial investment, decided to launch a takeover, and that's for us is generate close to €240 million of P&L, a very strong return.

We use the balance sheet to really do two things: deliver good investment and generate business. That's illustrate perfectly what we've been doing for 22 years.

Now moving forward, and looking at the next four years, the next chapter, what are going to be our allocation policy as far as balance sheet is concerned: We are now exiting this phase where, as we mentioned, balance sheet was a gross enabler. We are entering into this next phase where balance sheet will be strategic allocator.

Our priority will be now probably to deploy less, rotate faster, target higher velocity, and more value-add opportunities. No change here: Balance sheet allocation will be geared forward Tikehau Capital strategies and ecosystem.

As far as Tikehau Capital strategies are concerned, obviously, we will keep on going, and we will have still strong skin in the game alongside our partners. A focus will be reinforced on value-add strategies in PE, in real estate, and in credit, with expected returns over 15%, and as I mentioned previously as well, greater flexibility, notably on co-investment.

On ecosystem, similar pattern: strategic transaction, focus on high-performing investment, and ancillary business. Three main objectives, very clear: improve portfolio velocity, generate increasing profitability, and grow shareholder return.

I mentioned lower capital intensity into the funds. If you have a look at the two previous cycles, from 2018 to 2021, average yearly allocation in the funds were roughly €450 million a year.

Since last cycle, from '22 to '25, it was roughly 450, but including co-investment. The allocation will still be keep on going within co-investment and Tikehau Capital Fund, but once again, lower capital intensity expected on this new cycle coming.

We mentioned profitability and this next phase with its strong objective. Clearly, three main pillars will be enhancing our profitability scheme for the coming years: First one, operating leverage, and I'll be giving you in a minute the details of that; performance-related earnings will be the second pillar on which we will be relying; and investment portfolio.

Operating leverage: We are exiting this cycle '22-'25, where we have reached €28 billion. We are now targeting more than €35 billion, €34 billion for this next chapter in the coming years.

Clearly here, we will be more selective in adding adjacencies and target new initiatives, where we'll be more focused clearly on scaling existing strategies. How are we going to achieve that?

Once again, by deepening institutional relationships, high-growth region such as APAC, Middle East, North America, and we will also broaden our distribution, like it was mentioned before by Antoine and Mathieu, notably to capture more private wealth demand. What will be the growth driver?

You have them here, but clearly all of them will be clearly used, and all the structure that was developed over the last 20 years, the 17 offices and the setup in place will be clear in this new target to once again achieve more than €35 billion, €34 billion of fundraising for this new cycle. Operating leverage, once again here, I think that we have demonstrated that over the latest two fundraising cycles, operating leverage has already taken place.

Asset management EBIT moving from €4 million to €114 million at the time of the latest Capital Market Day back in '22. Since then, reaching €150 million, as we have described this morning.

That's a 52% CAGR since IPO. Once again, this sustainable growth has been supported by mix improvement and scale efficiencies.

In that context, new chapter will be focused on reinforcement of this operating leverage, and we will be harvesting in this new phase. We are now targeting between 45% and 50% of core FRE margin by the year 2029.

Second pillar of this new phase of profitability, of this new phase of development, will be performance-related earnings. We've been repeating that for many years: strong value embedded within the underlying funds; share of allocation, more than 54% of allocation of this carried interest to the balance sheet, significant profitability driver.

We've seen that during the year '25, by the way, it was the highest year in term of performance-related earnings, €22 million. We mentioned this morning this €220 million of unrealized performance-related earnings.

That's how the picture looks like at end of September '25. That's the underlying carried interest, which are being valued at fund level.

We are expecting more than €160 million to be maturing before the year 2029. We are here providing you a kind of data point where we think the timing of this €220 million, where we think it will be realized.

By the way, that does not include any potential additional value creation that can be created between '25 and the next coming four years, which will potentially create additional carried interest. Third pillar of this new chapter, we mentioned operating leverage, we mentioned performance-related earnings, third one will be investment portfolio.

Here we wanted to provide you a data point, sorry to be a bit technical on that, but in term of how do we recognize within our P&L the return of the fund. Up until now, all of our funds in which the balance sheet was invested have obviously been realizing capital gains, they have been disposed underlying stake, and cash has been returned to the balance sheet.

However, we want to assess that up until the DPI is below one, it does not create any P&L impact at our balance sheet level. Up until now, we had effectively some cash flow, but no P&L impact.

As we are exiting the J-curve of most of our flagship, and as we will be entering over a DPI over one, we are expecting significant P&L effect from our balance sheet and the kind of new forward-looking that we are providing today as far as net results profitability is concerned. I was mentioning this J-curve effect, once again here, two key decisions, two new allocation that are being discussed today: First, allocation in new investments, which are allowing higher velocity; and second one, exiting J-curve for existing investments.

These two elements will clearly drive this third pillar on the investment portfolio. Important data point as well on investment portfolio: Since the IPO, two clear cycles: 2018-2021, '22-'25.

These two cycles have generated more than €1.6 billion of capital return to the balance sheet. The next cycle that we are facing, from '26 to '29, we are expecting an increasing return of capital for the balance sheet, roughly above €2 billion for the next four years, which means that all the investments, once again the investment portfolio that we have been describing together a few minutes ago, will generate more than €4 billion of return of capital for the balance sheet.

Now how we're going to use this €4 billion, and we had the question earlier today: new investments within our funds, balance sheet optimization, and shareholder return. Talking about shareholder return, we're here providing you a few data points, our historical dividend distribution history since IPO.

We are reiterating today our guidance, which is to effectively strong commitment to distribute more than 80% of our asset management EBIT per year, and meanwhile, we are providing you this new guidance on asset management EBIT for '26 and as well for '20 up until '29, notably reaching this 50- 45% to 50% core FRE margin. I hope that all these points once again are illustrating this next phase of development, once again based on these three pillars clearly identified and described together.

Antoine, Mathieu, maybe I will let you the floor for any conclusion remark, if any, or otherwise we can open Q&A. Thank you.

Thank you, Henri. Just commenting on the last slide on the dividend: As you notice, we've been two times since the IPO paying exceptional dividend.

If we continue to deliver strongly on the balance sheet return, we'll probably have excess capital, because as Henri described, we need to put less money into our asset management funds, we could expect probably in the next cycle to make sure that we improve the return for shareholder. Shall we take some questions?

Yeah.

Let's take some questions. Several questions from the room.

Question from RBC.

Hi, David Perlin, RBC Capital Markets. Thank you for taking my questions.

The first one on fee-related earnings margin development: Can you share more color on what sort of cost discipline assumption underpinned the margin expansion as you continue to scale? Second is on secondaries: Perhaps you could expand on what is your longer-term ambition for these funds and how competitive do you expect the secondary space to be over the next few years as some of your listed peers are actively pushing to accelerate growth there?

Then lastly on AI, and specifically if you observe any material impact on your cybersecurity mandates, also interested to know how you distinguish between AI winners and AI losers within your investment process. Thank you.

Thank you for your question. Maybe I take the first one on operational margin.

I think we have a slide, Théo, on basis point per management fees per asset class. If you can show that.

As everybody know, there is a strong pressure from management fees in the traditional asset manager which get totally disrupted by the ETF business. When it comes to private asset, we continue to preserve the management fees, if I may say, and if we can get the slide, you will get a sense.

Overall, our management fees remain a little bit stable, decline a little bit, but we have our private equity increasing in terms of size, and as you will see on the slide, the private equity management fees is improving. We were at 177, 1.77% percentage management fee last year.

We are above 1.85% management fees. When it comes to revenues, we think that revenue will increase because of the private equity is increasing at Tikehau in terms of size and businesses.

When we look at credit, it's not pressure, but our average management fees is declining because we are issuing more CLOs, and CLOs, the management fees is lower than the direct lending or the secondary private debt. Overall, we managed to keep the same management fees.

As Henri pointed, we have more performance fees. We noticed that in 2005 with a 5.4 basis point.

When it comes to revenue, to answer your question, revenues will continue to increase, we are fairly convinced of that. Henri mentioned it, we start managing the cost.

The first phase was really the growth phase: We open offices, we hire people. Now we are becoming much more cost-conscious, so that's mean that operating expense will probably be managed in a better way, and as a result, that will lead to an increase in the margin of our asset management business.

I'm happy to take the one on the secondaries. When we decided to launch the private credit secondaries, which is what we are focusing on right now, that was in the context of our opening in North America, in New York.

When we discussed with our partners, with Cécile here, who's leading our direct lending practice, we say, "Okay, what will be the differentiating angle for us to be another direct lender in the US, which is already a highly populated market?" That was seven years ago, that was even before what's going on right now.

We came to the conclusion that after this very solid and robust cycle of primary allocation to private credit over the past 10, 15 years, similar to what had happened to private equities and the development of secondaries private equity, there would be a natural opportunity to provide liquidity to some LPs allocated to the asset class who would be willing to rebalance their portfolios. We thought that we were best-positioned to do that because we were not a secondary solution provider like many of our competitors can be, and that's their positioning, but we were a credit investors at heart, and so we could demonstrate the merits of doing the underwriting, using our balance sheet, as Henri just told you, and that's how we launched this practice.

What was perceived in 2020 like a very cyclical opportunity that was right in the middle of COVID, people were throwing away their financial assets, became very quickly a structural strategy. Today, as some of our competitors and some more established names started to develop there, in a matter of four years, it has become an asset class on its own.

As Antoine said, we just closed our second vintage. We now have more track record than some of our competitors to demonstrate the merits of the strategy.

We've been allocating a lot of our on balance sheet. We've been using the balance sheet.

The example that Henri was saying earlier, I can elaborate on that. Our first fund was shy of $500 million, and then came an opportunity to buy a portfolio, actually a single asset, but a portfolio from a Taiwanese insurance company who was getting out of a Goldman Sachs mezzanine fund, a very large $15 billion fund, which were already an LP with, and we knew the credit, and we knew that in order to do that, we could not do that with the fund, or by the time we would go and pitch our LPs, "Oh, are you interested with this co-invest?"

the opportunity would be gone. That's where the balance sheet is the most differentiating asset, and that's why today we're trying to once again convince you that is not a burden, it's our most valuable asset, enabled us to underwrite that, get this asset at some very attractive financial terms, and then once you had secured this opportunity, bring on some LPs, including some Hong Kong-based insurance companies, European insurance companies, and turn this balance sheet capital into third-party fee-paying asset management.

Today, as we close the second vintage at a billion dollar capital, we are convinced, as I said earlier, that not only it's a natural evolution when you're in the private market to find some liquidity, and add on top of that the little noise that we've been having for the past few weeks, we would expect this to increase. Today, when you look at all the competitive landscape of our friends, other managers, it's probably $20 billion that has been raised by way of funds or SMAs, and the opportunity set in front of that is hundreds of billions.

Those are public, private pension funds, insurance companies, family offices who are rebalancing the portfolio. We like this situation where the supply/demand is totally unbalanced because that's where you become a little bit of a price setter.

As a consequence, today, those are public numbers we're disclosing in our fundraising: The close to $2 billion that we have deployed there have been bought at 84, 85 cents a dollar, which, on an average three, three and a half years remaining portfolio, you're creating a 500 basis points pick-up for this illiquidity. If you remember, in secondary private equity, during COVID, when interest rates were at zero, the secondary market was trading at a premium to NAV, because that's when people were like, "If I can deploy overnight some capital instead of having—" we had some negative interest rates, if you remember, having some cash at the bank was costing you some money.

Obviously, in some more defensive, downside-protected credit investment that we can underwrite, bottom-up, we like the risk-reward, and that we can generate effectively some mid-teen return, that's the return that we've been generating so far, which ticks exactly the type of return on equity we want to have for the balance sheet.

You had a question on AI and impact on our cybersecurity business. Difficult for me to comment on I'm a bit puzzled, to say the least, on AI winners and AI losers.

I've seen some company that are dealing with food premises and so on, big AI losers, and suddenly having decreasing value. Trying to understand that, I will not provide further comments.

All I can tell is that our cybersecurity business, we are currently operating the fourth vintage. We had strong demand from investors, and the size of Fund number four has roughly doubled.

By the way, meanwhile, something is currently happening over the last years, notably since '22, which is clearly called sovereignty. I think there is a clear here a new environment, new paradigm, where people are realizing that it's key.

I can tell you that within our portfolio, we are the biggest venture cybersecurity business with this fund in Europe. We are a shareholder of a company called ChapsVision.

It's a global data treatment, all its system are being used by the European government. Some may call it the European Palantir, but clearly this company is growing significantly.

We are a shareholder of a company called MemoIT, which is a company providing data access to local information system locally or at distance. I can tell you what we are seeing is strong business growth in all these companies, because many companies in Europe are trying to replace and to be less dependent from the US on all these sectors.

Isobel from Autonomous, thank you.

Hi, this is Isobel from Autonomous Research. Thanks for taking my questions, I have two, please.

My first question, it was in the context that I understood from the full-year '25 results session that you expect FRE operating expenses to be broadly flat year-on-year, first of all, correct me if I misunderstood there. Given this, we are seeing a number of your global peers move aggressively into Europe, both institutional fundraising and on the private wealth side, including lots of hiring of dedicated sales teams to push distribution.

How are you thinking about reconciling the need for operating cost control against maintaining or expanding your competitive positioning and market share? Then my second question is on PRE.

Thank you for the color on when you think it's going to mature. On the €160 million that you expect to mature before 2029, should we expect that to be more back-end loaded towards 2029, or could we see a substantial share come through this year, please?

I appreciate that might be hard to predict, but maybe if you could set out some parameters: Do we need a certain fund to do very well, or a couple of disposals to trigger that first recognition? Thank you.

That

Go ahead, go ahead.

That performance-related earnings, I don't have an Excel spreadsheet with every month, for the it will obviously depend from value creation and exits. Obviously internally we are we have all of our underlying 600 position that we are hosting on PE, private debt, we are working on some kind of forecast, but difficult effectively to to provide you data a strong data set either by year or by quarter

by quarter. Maybe what we can say is that the figure you saw here, the 220, it was the same figures two years ago, if you recollect,

and

we had in between for the two years 40. We received 40, 22 this year and a little bit less in 2023, we still have the same 220.

That's mean that our AUM base is growing, our eligible AUM base to carry the interest is growing. As we try to be conservative on that because you cannot really predict PRE.

What we can say is that we are building more and more private equity exposure, which will generate probably more carried interest than traditional real estate or credit. When Henri and Vincent highlighted 2.6x multiple on exit on private equity, it's generating more carried.

I think we are very optimistic, very difficult to predict because it depends on the market, on your asset, where you're going to exit. We are fairly confident that one, it's growing, and it's highly diversified, because secondary private debt is another example where we're going to get carried interest as well.

That's mean that we are diversifying our pool of carried interest, difficult to predict, but it's improving, and we are very confident of that.

If I may, co-investment carried interest are obviously quicker than fund carried interest.

Maybe if you go back to your first question regarding retail, one of the firm motto is create, don't compete. 30% of the money we manage is coming from retail investor directly or indirectly.

We've been pioneer in France with unit-linked product. We launched with our partner Intesa four years ago a very big program.

We've done the same thing with our partner in Abu Dhabi, First Abu Dhabi Bank. We just signed something with the largest bank in Singapore.

My comment is that we still have 30% of our AUM coming from retail investors, I mentioned large family offices that investing directly with us. Do we need, to go back to your question, do we need to build a giant sales force to tackle the retail?

We are not convinced, and that's not what we're going to do. We see our peer group in the US hiring hundreds of people to cover IFAs, banks, and so on.

We are fairly convinced that we can keep growing there without adding gigantic cost, number one. Number two, we'll try to be more digital, we create our own platform, Opal, which is already fully operational.

It's not gigantic, but in 2025, we raised €260 million through this channel, and it's a greenfield. We don't think we need to add a lot of resources.

Our competition is doing the other way around, and they have larger brand than us, the US guys, not the European guys. We are fairly convinced that it will not destroy the profitability of the asset management.

Maybe to preempt a follow-on question, which is all this retail focus by many, we've been fairly constant and public on that. We thought that there might have been a bit of mis-selling in trying to address this market with open-ended evergreen structure.

I'm not only reacting to the headlines of the past few days, but there's been, I don't want to name anybody, but there's been some things on the real estate happening: How can you have some daily liquidity when you're owning 25 building the City of London? How do you want to offer the liquidity to your clients?

On the private equity, the same thing, and some of those funds have grown exponentially because obviously you had a very good brand, a good track record, and some people may have said, and it's not about the managers, sometimes the distribution saying, "Oh, you can buy this private equity or private debt fund, it's like buying European equity UCITS." It's not the same thing when it comes to liquidity.

Our conviction is that you rarely die of your assets, but very often of your liabilities. That's a risk that is now in the market, that don't want to be overreacting to some news flow, but part of what we show you, we have, out of the €52.8 billion, we've got €200 million in an open-ended structure with a targeted return of 7% to 8% when the other people are showing a low-teen because of the leverage which is putting.

We are looking at the technology. We want to make sure that we can address and tackle the opportunity, but that we will never compromise with the asset-liability matching that we believe is what we owe to our customers.

There are some products whereby you don't really need a specific sales force. We launched one unit-linked product with our French partner Société Générale.

It's a unit-linked product dedicated to aerospace and defense, and for the first two months, it's been €1 million per day more or less, and it's not our sales force, it's really the sales force of the bank. We don't need to add extra people to market that.

Question from Nicolas Payen from Kepler. Here, please.

Thank you, Lucy.

Yes, good morning. Thanks for taking my question.

Nicolas Payen from Kepler Cheuvreux. A first one on net inflows: Just wondering what kind of environment assumption have you baked in your planning when you set up your net inflow targets?

Also if you could give us a bit of color regarding the kind of asset class mix you're expecting regarding net inflows till 2029, that's the first question. Then the second one will be on balance sheet investment returns.

Thank you very much for your comments regarding the acceleration on the J-curve. Just wondering what kind of returns shall we expect in the balance sheet.

If I remember well, last time you mentioned something like 10% to 15% return on balance sheet investment, wondering if that still holds. Thank you.

Maybe when

I start with net inflows, as Mathieu, when he started, highlighted, it's fourth year in a row record year when it comes to fundraising. If you look at the net new money, the €8 billion we get out of the €10.5 billion gross, it's now really coming from all around the world, and still 50% is going into private credit, but within private credit, it's highly diversified between secondary private debt, direct lending, CLO, and so on.

My point here is that we try to diversify as much as possible. As business owner, you want to build a very diversified business.

Now that the platform is fully operating, we're going to expect net inflows coming from all around the globe. For the first time, we had a reinsurance company invested €500 million with us in 2025.

12 12 months ago, we never came across this investor. We had a German reinsurance company investing €350 million with us in 2025, first time; large Japanese insurance company investing €200 million in 2025 in the direct lending fund.

To illustrate that, the net inflows will come from all around the globe. We will probably benefit from the geopolitical at some point, I give you one of our favorite topic: Canadian pension fund, which are by far the largest, probably similar to the superannuities in Australia, they used to put all their money with the large US GPs, now they want to find European and Asian GP.

Going back to your question, the net inflows will really come broadly from all the geographies, number one. When you look at institutional investor and retail, we comment a little bit earlier, but we keep build the infrastructure, the technology to attract retail investor.

It will also come on specific asset classes, so as everybody know, real estate has been very difficult for a lot of people around the globe. We've been very acquisitive in 2024 and 2025, we start reinvesting in real estate because we see very good opportunities.

I suspect we're going to be the one benefiting from this shift back to real estate. We are not commenting and giving the exact breakdown of the 2029 in terms of asset classes breakdown, so that will be my answer on net inflows.

Maybe Mathieu...

It's an anecdote, but I kind of like it. In Q2 2025, a year ago, we raised more in Latin America than we raised in France.

For me it was an interesting anecdote, because I've never been there, Antoine has never been there. We've got our colleagues covering Peru, Chile, Mexico from Madrid.

By working this market over the past two years, now we're starting harvesting at a time where our domestic market. That's where this complementary comes.

This harvesting concept where we've been reinforcing all morning, it's really about that, that we made the investments, be it our CapEx or our OpEx, and now you're starting to have the investment payback.

Maybe your second question on balance sheet return: Our goal is to make sure we continue to deliver mid-teen returns. We've been a little bit trapped into J-curve, as Henri described.

The way we are allocating the balance sheet moving forward is probably in a much more cautious manner. We have still the same target, and by the way, we built the firm being good investor at building the balance sheet.

I like saying that, but we started Tikehau as an investment company in 2004, and it's only three years after that we launched the asset management. The asset management has been able to grow from €4 million EBIT to €150 million of EBIT because we've been seeding the strategy and investing.

We are investor before being asset manager, and I think we're going to be very disciplined and probably much more disciplined than when we were before. I'm not saying that we were not disciplined, but now it's really the time of harvesting, and the investment committee managing the balance sheet called the Capital Allocation Committee is becoming much more difficult.

For instance, when internal teams are knocking at the door to say, "Yeah, we have a new strategy, we want to launch a new fund dedicated to cycling, and we are targeting 7%," but the likelihood we take the piece of paper and it's going directly in the shredder is 100%. When it comes to balance sheet investment, balance sheet return, we're going to stick to the same mid-teen return, which going to be a mix of stuff, because asset classes are different, but that's what we target.

No, last point, going back to your first question, there's no dependence on one geography or one asset owner type for our fundraising. Now it's really broadened.

The same thing you may have picked up this morning in the detailed report we issued, last year our real estate fundraising on our open-ended funds and our CMS fundraising was actually very modest, to say the least, which historically have been very strong engine of growth. Obviously those two are open-ended, but you should expect a significant pick-up there, too.

He wanted to say engine.

Questions from Iulian, ODDO BHF. Thank you.

Good

afternoon, and thanks for taking my questions. I have two.

Perhaps the first one is on the core FRE guidance that you give. Just wondering if you could speak about the drivers for reaching the upper end of the range, so that would be the 50%, kind of think about the building blocks or what would be the step-up from 45% to 50%?

The other one is if you could also say something about the potential gaps that you've identified in the operating model, perhaps strategies, niches, and that you'd like to develop or, often using Antoine's words, innovate as you enter in this new growth cycle.

On the core FRE margin, I provided earlier the three main drivers. Obviously, we have the mixed effect driving the core FRE margin.

We have, in term of revenue, the payoffs of co-investment, as well as an important feature. The more we are able to structure co-investment with additional revenue will be as well impacting that.

Then there you have, on the other way around, obviously, all the cost initiative. Here we will be more cautious, notably on extending any geography or extending any services.

Difficult to assess in term of timing, but we are clearly seeing something like 50% could be achieved depending on the pace, on deployment, on these three drivers.

Probably it will depend, as on the business mix. If we have more private equity coming, obviously the operating margin is improving, and the plan is really to keep growing at a faster space our private equity.

If you think about it, at the IPO time, we had no private equity, apart of balance sheet investment, now we are getting close to $10 billion of private equity. In a difficult market, because nobody has been waiting for us, private equity is suffering a lot.

The margin will be depending also on the pace of our private equity expansion.

If I may on private equity, I think you mentioned it, but I think we are the only one to have such differentiating factors, notably this partnering with industrials. We are relying on these two main transition, energy transition, this decarbonization on one hand, and aerospace and defense on the other.

On both strategies, we've been partnering with the biggest knowledgeable people in the industry, and that provides a key differentiating factor.

Going back to your question on innovation, we really built the firm innovating, and it's been asset class. It just was Henri described, people doing private equity have been generalist, we decided to be specialized just because we said that we're not going to be another LBO shop, we decided to be vertical.

We are studying various vertical right now. You're going to see us innovating.

We want to make sure while we innovate, we are doing stuff we understand. We don't expect to be active in cryptocurrency or we're going to stick to what we are good at, it's sourcing good opportunities that we understand.

We have a lot of idea, and we keep having a lot of idea. What changed probably is that we want to make sure that when we launch a new strategy, it needs to be really scalable.

In the past, we thought that we had great idea, so, for instance, my colleague will kill me, but we launched something called Tikehau Green Assets, which was an amazing idea, an amazing team, and we have €130 million into the fund, and I must say that €130 million is totally subscale. We want to make sure that while we innovate, it needs to be really scalable, above a billion for sure, and potentially make sure it's multi-billion.

You should see, I guess, some extension or let's say adjacencies. When launching, I don't know, let's say CLO, CLO is a very scalable, but commoditized product.

When we launched in the US four years ago, we had been operating in London since 2015. The CLO pool in the US, because of the nature of and the structure of the market, is running twice as fast, and we're scaling, we're now pricing our CLO number eight in four years, when we had 15 in London.

When we launched direct lending in Asia, that's because we think that we're getting to the point with the right partnership, the right shareholders, the right investors to effectively have these adjacencies of a first fund, a first move, that then we'll be able to scale. As Antoine said, our very first direct lending fund in 2007, it's almost 20 years now, it was €125 million.

The last vintage, number six, that we just closed a couple of weeks ago, is past €5 billion. You get effectively all that is feeding the operating leverage and the operating margin that we were talking about.

You should see us expanding in real estate in North America. We've got a €20 billion real estate platform in Europe, we're managing public REITs, private REITs, commingled funds, open-ended funds.

There is an opportunity right now that the natural extension into real estate, be it debt or equity, is made, I wouldn't say at marginal cost, but it's made at a phase in our development that the drop-through is also feeding your bottom line. That's where you will see some natural extension of the platform.

Thank you. Maybe I'm conscious of time.

One last question from this gentleman from DLTV, Beltrán Palazuelo. Thank you.

Hello, thank you for taking my question. I have two, if I may.

First one is share price, no? It's very strong execution, very strong everything, but the share price does not reflect it.

How far is this management team willing to execute its tools in order that the market recognizes its intrinsic value? Because I think the market is not nearly recognizing the net asset value of its balance sheet.

The second is strategies for risk mitigation for the thirst of the French government of taxing everything. What no ideas, no, when we see all competitors, sometimes they have other jurisdictions, no, to make their tax not go higher and higher.

Thank you very much, and thank you for the strong execution.

Thank you for your question. Share price, needless to say, not only because as we are the largest shareholder, because the employee still control 54% of the firm, we get very frustrated, as some of our shareholder.

I think to cope with that, few things: One, we need to make sure we keep executing, and it's painful, because you execute and your share price is not moving. If you look the slide I like on the EBIT, you started, when you list, the asset management was €4 million EBIT, now it's €150 million.

Let's forget everything, okay? I'm launching a new company, I give you a business plan, and I'm telling you that nine years from now, I'm going to reach €150 million of EBIT.

Everybody will tell, "Okay, this guy, he smokes something, because you cannot move from zero to €150 million of EBIT." We're going to keep delivering on the profitability of the asset management, and I think it's really accelerating.

That's number one. Number two, the balance sheet, and that's why, on purpose, I put this slide: We have really two businesses which are very different.

We use the balance sheet to launch the asset management, to seed, to accelerate. We are fairly convinced that the sum of the two balance sheet, the sum of the part, if I may say, is probably twice at least where we trade now at €16.

We're going to try to keep delivering, but also at some point, if we are not able to move the share price, and it's not only, I think, hopefully us, the sector, it's also mid-market stock market in Europe is a little bit broken, at some point it will come back, and we start seeing a lot of US investor coming to buy European shares, not only doing takeover as Nevine on Schroders, but we start more US guys coming. Hopefully it will change the market, because we need the market to change.

I must say that, if we are not able to change the stock price just doing our regular job, and probably increasing the payouts for the shareholder, we may took more I don't know, structural changes, and we already simplified the structure. When we listed, as everybody will remember, we had a baroque structure, we simplified the group.

Now we are clearly saying that we have two businesses, and I'm not telling you that we are going to split the company in two companies, but we want to make sure, if you are listed, that the stock price and the stock performance is working. Because when you travel the world, everybody is looking at your stock price.

You pitch a Korean investor for your direct lending, the first thing he's doing is Google stock price: flat, a little bit down. "Well, these guys are telling me they deliver a lot of performances at their fund level, but..."

We are all on top of that, we are spending a fair amount of time.

Now, as the asset management is more profitable, I think it's going to be much more easy for us to change that. There's plenty of option, structural optionality.

I guess that's part of the message we wanted to convey today. We've always been long-term greedy in making sure we can demonstrate and execute, because when you start from zero or five, you have to show over a cycle of few cycle that you're delivering, which, I'm convinced, we are doing, and the rest should follow.

If it does not follow, there are some structural optionality. Now your question on France is a key question.

We're going to face election

for sure

in a few months. We are dealing with it, and difficult to comment, but we are dealing with it.

That's why, I think I've mentioned it two times already, but we make sure we build a very diversified business in terms of asset classes, geographies, both on the asset and liability side. We want to make sure we raise money all around the globe, and we want to make sure we invest more or less everywhere in Europe, but also Mathieu mentioned North America.

We start doing more and more real estate, because real estate is a mess, we took advantage of that being contrarian. At the end of the day, we're going to build a global diversified business, and it's changing all the time.

The perspective, we discussed Spain and Italy 10 years ago, when we opened So this year, sorry, in 2025, it was the 10-year anniversary of our Italian opening in Milan, okay? People at the board of Tikehau told us 10 years ago, "You're opening in Milan, are you crazy?"

Now everybody is going to Milan. That's why, once again, create, don't compete.

We have very strong conviction. France remain France.

It's one of the largest country in Europe when it when you look at, economic footprint, innovation. We're going to continue to do stuff in France, but maybe the way we allocate is going to be, more diversified.

Thank you so much, everybody. Thank you to the speakers, to the audience today for your engagement.

We can continue our discussions in a more informal manner with a light cocktail. Big thank you to the IR team that works in the shadow, and thank you very much, and we look forward to build this next chapter together.

Thank you.