Yeah. Hi, thank you.

Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to Bansal Wire Industries Q4 and FY26 earnings call. Joining me today is Mr.

Ghanshyam Gujrati, our CFO. I trust you've had the opportunity to review our financial results, press release, and investor presentation, which are available on the stock exchanges and on our website.

Now, let me start by saying that this year has been a year of a lot of major changes for the company. In fact, I would say that we have completely transformed ourselves through the process and have emerged stronger and sharper.

Let me highlight some of the major events of the last year. First and the most important would be our improved focus on ROCE and cash flow generation.

As part of this approach, we deferred our backward integration project, undertook a comprehensive review of operational efficiencies, and realigned our strategy towards our core competencies. As a result, we were able to generate a cash flow of 333 crores, exceeding our initial target of 250 crores.

We remain on track for achieving our total target of 600 crores by 2027. By doing this, we have also remained well-positioned to fund our growth ambitions while maintaining financial discipline.

Second, even though there was a fire incident in our steel cord shed, which led to a delay in our approval process, we made meaningful progress in strengthening our specialty and value-added wire portfolio, with ISHT wire demonstrating a strong momentum, Phase 1 ramping up in line and with even [ex- ex-?] exceeding our expectations.

We also received a faster-than-expected approval. Phase 2 of the expansion is also progressing as planned, adding 6,000 tonnes of capacity on the existing 9,000 tonnes.

Even on the steel cord front, we have made a major breakthrough and are expecting our very first trial order very soon. Next, we started our LRPC wire product with 18,000 tonnes of capacity, which is also towards the end of this year started generating positive EBITDA.

During the last year, we also strengthened our B2C segment with a focused strategy on expanding our distribution network, enhancing brand visibility, and introducing customer-centric product offerings. This segment has also started picking up, and we have launched 16 new product offerings for the western and southern part of the country.

Turning to our manufacturing footprint, our installed capacity now stands at approximately 6,80,000 metric tonnes, with the Dadri facility continuing to anchor our growth. During this year, we added about 1,20,000 tonnes of capacity at Dadri, completing our first phase of this expansion.

This facility not only supports volume growth, but also enables us to deliver high value-added products with improved consistency and better operational efficiencies. Last and, I would say, one of the most important events, which is something we are all dealing with, particularly in the month of March, we saw some disruptions due to geopolitical tensions involving Iran and Israel, which led to volatility in global energy markets and supply chain challenges.

We also experienced a temporary disruption in natural gas. Our production took a cut to 35%, which also had a short-term impact on our production schedule.

Despite these headwinds, our volume remained resilient, increasing by 33% for the full year, while EBITDA and revenue grew by approximately 20%, reflecting our underlying strength of our business. As we enter the next year, we anticipate a relatively subdued start, particularly in the first quarter, given the ongoing situation.

However, we are proactively taking measures to mitigate these impacts and remain confident in our ability to navigate the near-term challenges. Once conditions stabilize, we still expect us to return on our targeted 20% growth trajectory, supported by our strategic initiatives and already available capacity.

I now hand over the call to Mr. Ghanshyam Gujrati, our CFO.

Thank you, Pranav sir, and good afternoon, everyone. Let me walk through the key financial and operational highlights for the quarter four and for the full year FY26.

Let me begin with the volumes. During this quarter, we delivered a sales of 1.17 lakh metric tonnes, reflecting a 20% year-on-year increase.

Volume were slightly lower on a sequential basis, primarily stemming from the disruption of industrial gas supply, as highlighted by our MD sir, Pranav ji. For the full year, volume stood at 4.58 lakh metric tonnes, compared to 3.44 lakh metric tonnes in FY26, translating into 33% year-on-year growth, and making the highest annual sales volume achieved by the company.

This volume was sustained consistently across the quarter and supported by the broad-based demand that our diversified end market expose- exposure provide us. Moving to the financial for quarter four of FY26, revenue stood at 1,136 crores, reflecting 21% year-on-year growth.

EBITDA for the quarter was ₹80 crores, with a margin of 7%, and net profit came in to at ₹40 crores, up 21% year-on-year. For the full year full year FY26, revenue stood at 4,160 crores, reflecting a growth of 19% over FY26.

EBITDA was 325 crores, up 17% year-on-year. Net profit for the year stood at ₹161 crores, higher by 10%, both reflecting healthy growth over the last year.

With that, I conclude my remarks. We can now open the floor for question.

Thank you.

Hi. Am I audible, sir?

Thank you for the opportunity, sir. Congratulations, especially during the third month of the quarter, still you have been able to keep your volumes intact.

Congratulations on that, sir. My first question is pertaining to one of your opening statement where you stated that the year has started on bit of a subdued note.

Is it possible to quantify what is the issue, particularly from say gas? What is the gas availability today?

What can be the headwinds or what can be the volume disruptions particularly for Q1 of this current financial year?

Sure, sir. Q1, we've started with, of course, lesser volumes.

In fact, last month, our volumes were cut to an extent of 35%. However, those are back.

We are now expecting about 80-85% kind of our volumes to be there. Other than volume, there is also an issue in demand as of now.

Other than, I would say, the automotive segment, all other segments that we see, we still see a lack of demand. All our customers, all segments are still undergoing these issues.

Till the time this doesn't go back to normal, I am not expecting sales also visibility to be there. It is difficult for me to quantify this.

I think we are all on the same boat, and we'll have to see how it goes. What I can say is that once we normalize, I think overall we are still expecting 20% kind of a number to be there.

Of course, only once we normalize.

Sure. We respect that, sir, that you have kept your yearly volume guidance intact at say 20% growth.

Just wanted to just add on to that that despite say volumes are down considering the gas disruption and the demand, I believe the prices would have been much better, right? Because the steel prices have gone up substantially, especially post the starting of the year.

The prices are already up on the range of almost about 10-15%. Will that actually support your top line despite you losing on the volumes?

Yes, I would say that would definitely support our top line. That would still not translate to real earnings.

At the end of the day, our business is still driven by volumes and EBITDA per tonne. In fact, if we talk about only EBITDA, because of operating at a lower base, even our cost is higher.

Our EBITDA per tonne will also take some hit. Revenues might be intact or might be higher.

At the end of the day, it is all about the quantities that I am able to sell. Sure.

Is it possible to quantify that, sir? The number, by any chance?

Sir, right now, it is very difficult. Every day is a new day.

Every day we have different challenges. It is definitely getting better.

We'll still have to see how long this happens, sir.

Sure. Sir, my second question was particularly to the steel cord business.

Since IPO, practically, we have been stating that the approvals would be there. However, there were some headwinds.

Now I think about a con call or two con calls back, you had stated that we'll be entering the Phase 2 trial process. This call, you have stated that you are almost on the verge of getting the first trial order or the first order.

What can be the quantum and what can be the delta now that finally things have been looking up for you from the steel cord vertical? From which customer you're seeing these orders?

Which of the automobile company?

The order we would be receiving would be from the top four companies in India. Yes, our year started slow because of the fire incident, but we've picked up.

It will be our first trial order. Once we supply that order and if the customer finds everything to be intact, then we can expect a regular order from these customers.

Now,

when that will happen, how that will happen, we will keep you updated. It is very hard to predict today.

Sure. The Phase 2 trial is already been completed, right, if I'm not mistaken then?

Yes, with one customer which we would expect this order from, yes, there will not be a Phase 2 trial process. It will only be a sample and then some orders.

Got it. Sir, and if I may quickly squeeze in the last one from my side.

Broad benchmark numbers are fine, but is it possible to quantify what is the share of say low-carbon, high-carbon, and specialty in top line as well as the EBITDA? In percentage terms is also fine.

Yeah. Overall, our product mix has remained the same.

I think 55-ish percent of low-carbon, 25 high-carbon, and 20% stainless steel. In general, this is the broad thought process that we have, and there has not been a major change here.

Then low-carbon would have much lower EBITDA contribution, so that means your EBITDA would be much higher from high-carbon and stainless as compared to low-carbon. Is it that understood, yeah?

What is our share there at the EBITDA level? Yes.

Sir, we will not be able to give you separate EBITDA levels for all streams. What we would be showing to you is the EBITDA per tonne on a blended basis.

This is where we focus on.

Sure. That was quite helpful, sir.

If I have any further questions, I'll join back in the queue. Thank you so much

and

best of luck, sir. Thank you.

Hey, hi Pranav. Thanks for the opportunity.

The first question was largely on the industry side. Given it's a low-margin industry and we are the market leaders here, I would assume this gas problem would be faced by a lot of your competitors who are in a much smaller scale.

Fair to assume that they would be in pretty much bad situation right now if demand is weak, and we can expect to gain market share despite demand being weak right now?

Sir, if you break this demand situation into different sectors that we have, I would say the automotive sector has been doing well. There we are still able to grow even through all of this.

I think for us, automotive is okay. Every other sector, whether it is consumer durable, infra, all of there, we are seeing a very sluggish demand.

This is because of two reasons. One is there has been a big price increase in steel in the last three months, and the second is, of course, the situation we are all going through.

It still looks positive. Every day is getting better.

Let's see what happens.

Understood. In the past, when we had stated that to gain market share, we would be taking a hit on our margins.

Is that phase largely behind us or do you think to gain this 20% growth this year as well, our EBITDA margins or EBITDA per tonne would be likely lower than what we showed this year?

No, from this year, there's no negative impact on EBITDA, which we foresee in terms of our regular operations. If we grow at 20%, our EBITDA should also grow at 20%.

Of course, this current situation, we have to keep aside, but once we turn back to normal, I think our EBITDA per tonne should be same or if not better.

Okay. Lastly, what's the update on the two units, I think, Balaji Wires and Bansal [Ikar?]

, which were going to be shut down? What's the plan there right now?

Those two units, again, are operating at almost negligible capacity utilization. All of it has mostly shifted to Bansal Wire.

I think maybe the last 4-5% that would be remaining would shift in another maybe 6-8 months.

Okay. Thanks, Pranav.

All the best, I'll join back the queue.

Thank you.

Hello?

Am I audible?

ma'am, you are.

Yeah. Thank you so much for this opportunity.

Sir, firstly, you mentioned that currently also we are operating at around 80-85% volume. We see 20% production cut in the month of April as well.

Going forward, how confident are we to maintain this 20% sort of guidance that we've given? Do you see any downside?

Because you mentioned that auto sector is doing well, but that contributes I think around 22% to our revenues. Is there any sort of downside you see to this 20% guidance?

Ma'am, again, right now, it is very difficult for me to give you a number because it is a very dynamic situation that we are all in. Yes, as of now, what I see is that situation is getting better.

Right now, there is sluggishness in demand, but we feel that it is getting better every day. We are hoping for the best.

Once it turns back to normal, yes, we should be able to grow at 20% because we have that kind of a capacity available with us from the starting of the year.

Fair. Given the current value, we are fairly confident we will be able to do 20% growth.

Once we return back to normal, yes, 20% growth is what we should be able to do.

Okay. This ISHT wire segment, this new segment that we added, what sort of capacity utilization were we at in Q4?

In Q4, I would not have the right figures, but, yeah, I would say in the month of March alone, we were at about 25% capacity utilization in ISHT, and which is increasing by maybe 10-15 which should increase by 10-15% every month.

What sort of EBITDA per tonne do we see in this one?

Ma'am, right now, it is not contributing much, but once we touch 50% capacity utilization, I think it should turn into positive EBITDA.

Okay. What sort of capex are we looking for FY27?

FY27,

or in fact, even in the years later, I think our capex strategy is now focused on our cash flows. What we are expecting is majority of or maybe 60-70% of our cash flows we will pull back into capex.

Maybe 150-200 crores, something like that, to generate enough capacities to grow at 20%.

The product mix that you mentioned, 55% low-carbon and 25 high and 20% specialty, that we expect to be pretty much stable in FY27?

That should be stable in this year as well. That's specialty right now, in a percentage, is nothing, it's 20% of stainless.

Yes, in this year, specialty should also come as part of this product mix.

Fair enough. Thank you so much, that is it from my side.

Thank you.

Thank you for the opportunity. Am I audible?

sir. Hi, Pranav.

Pranav, my first question is with respect to our payables. This year, we have seen a sharp spike in our payable, both in absolute terms as well as increase in the number of days.

Just wanted to understand, have we structurally made any changes in the way we are sourcing? Let's say, instead of a mill, are we procuring more through dealers on account of which we are getting better credit term, hence the payable days have improved for us?

Yeah. Sir, we are still buying from our main suppliers.

Most of those suppliers, we are still paying them advance. We've also included a lot of discounting limits from this year, which is where you are seeing the payable being higher.

This is part of the discounting facility that we have done in purchases. Our vendor is still getting advance payment, whereas we get that kind of a credit.

If I understood correctly, you're still procuring from the steel mills, but instead of paying them on an advance basis, you're using purchase invoice discounting where the bank pays them and you pay the bank later, correct?

Yes, absolutely.

Thanks. Do you see, means, going forward, this number to go up further?

To say your payable days going up higher as you increase your banking or discounting through let's say the banking methods,

means, or

do you think that right now it has come at a stable level?

No, sir. It can go higher as and when we are trying to reduce our total working capital days.

In that effort, it could go higher gradually.

Will that also lead to increase our interest expense?

That will definitely lead to increase in our interest expense, but not disproportionately. We are already paying that interest even today, but that is done through our regular limits.

Got it.

There should not be a further increase in interest cost because of this.

Got it. The second question is on our balance sheet.

If I see that from last presentation to this presentation, we have expanded our capacity by around 60,000 metric tonne, right? Despite that, if I look at your balance sheet, we are having an 213 crore of capital work-in-progress.

Just wanted to understand what is that.

This capital work-in-progress is part of the 60,000 tonnes also, which we have installed, but not commissioned till date. That will happen in this month, month of April, one.

Second, this is also part of some ongoing investment to further enhance our Dadri facility. From this 6.8 lakh tonne, we would want to, this year, add another 1.2 lakh tonne so that we are prepared for the year after this.

This is where this kind of investment is going in.

Okay. If I understand correctly, we were in the process of adding around, I think, 90,000 tonnes in Sanand, right?

You are saying now that from 6.8, again, we'll be adding 1.2 lakh tonne in Dadri itself. Would it be fair to assume in FY27, you'll be adding 1.2 in Dadri and let's say 0.9 in Sanand?

Sir, that 0.9 will come towards the end of '27. We will only be able to utilize that in '28.

Okay.

Not in '27. Therefore, for this complete year, we would still be adding some capacities here and there.

For example, the ongoing ISHT wire expansion of 6,000 tonnes is happening right now. There are some expansion for low-carbon, high-carbon also.

Okay.

For us to have the capacity headroom to grow at 20% for the next 2-3 years.

Got it. As per your internal estimate, let's say by end of FY27, our capacity will increase from 6.8 lakh to what number?

From 6.8 lakh, it should be at least 8 lakhs. With Sanand coming in, it might be 8.5 or 8.6, something like that.

You are saying because the demand situation is so dynamic that you would want to tweak your capex number. That's the correct way to read about it, right?

Our capex investment side should be capped at 200 crores or something like that. We should not be going higher than that for a year to be growing at this pace.

Okay. Okay.

Yes, we see a good demand other than this situation. We were already utilizing a good amount of capacities.

Even in last quarter, if you leave March aside, at least 15-16 days of March aside, we were doing a good run rate. It is only in the last 15 days that we took a hit.

Even then, we were able to do about 1,20,000 tonnes in that quarter. We have a good opportunity once situation returns to normal, I think, yeah, we can do something good.

Therefore, the 20% number growth thought process still remains.

Okay. In this 1,20,000 capacity that we are looking to add in Dadri itself, would it be equally split between low-carbon, high-carbon, and specialty, or it would be more leaning towards let's say low-carbon and high-carbon?

It would be, yeah, I think it would be similar to the current product mix that we have. Not a big change.

Got it.

In some ways, maybe some specialty would increase disproportionately, but yeah, other than that, I think, overall same.

Okay. This last question on this steel cord business.

I think last time, you indicated that we were undergoing some field trials and now you're saying that some trial runs are going on. Is it similar to the field trials or is it that the field trials has been completed and you'll be sending your first trial batch, and then ultimately, if that gets approved, you will start commercial supply?

Sir, generally, the process is that once we receive a sample approval, the product goes for field trial. With some customers, because of the results that they've gotten from the sample itself, there are some customers who've removed the field trial process.

Therefore, we are expecting a trial order from them. Once we receive the trial order, once we supply them, they test it, then we can actually expect a regular supply level.

Even though there was a delay because of the fire, because of this, we've been able to cover that time also.

Okay. That is expected to happen in H2 of this fiscal year, correct?

That's the thought process. That's only one customer.

Overall, we are still expecting the other customers to be in line by the end of this year.

Okay. Thanks, Pranav.

Very helpful. All the best.

Thanks, sir. Thank you, sir.

Yeah. Thank you for the opportunity.

Am I audible?

Yes, sir.

Yeah. Firstly, my question is on the Sanand balance land.

Post we scrapped off our plan for the backward integration, in the last con call also, you had said probably the decision to sell or to come up with another capex will be taken in the next quarter or so. Have we come up with any decision on that balance 50% land?

Sir, the balance 50% land, we would be trying to sell it off to get that cash in. We have deferred our backward integration project.

For the next couple of years, it does not fit in our strategic investment scheme. Any decision that we take on backward integration would at least be after those two years, because we already have specialty wire which is now turned very well for us, and the regular market of high-carbon, low-carbon wherein we would want to spend most of our investments.

Got it, got it. The next question is with regards to our EBITDA per tonne, if you look at this particular quarter, it was the lowest in the last eight quarters, I'm talking excluding other income.

What was the volume mix?

There was not a major change in volume mix. The EBITDA per tonne impact that you see would also be because of the last 15 days in March.

There was a substantial increase in our gas prices to a tune of ₹4,000 to ₹5,000 a tonne on our product level, which is something that we had to absorb because we have a 30-to-40-day order book.

Got it, got it, sir.

Although we have started getting that increase from our customers, but the 30-to-40-day order that we have has to go with that kind of a cost level. We've taken some hit in EBITDA only in those 15 days.

Got it, fine. Just a reiteration of what the previous participant had asked regarding the new 1.2 lakh tonne capacity that will be coming up at Dadri, FY27, the total capacity would be 8 lakhs, right?

Utilization levels, what can we expect, blended?

Sir, that depends on how the year goes. Yes, we have already done about 4.8 lakh 4.6 lakh tonnes this year.

We were expecting to increase this by at least 20% if it was a normal situation. Whenever it turns to normal, I think we will be in that run rate.

Okay. Just to understand, when will that 1.2 lakh capacity be available?

That will be towards the end of the year. Because we already are sitting on a reasonable capacity right now.

For the first half of the year, at least we don't need it. With this situation, we've also tried to delay some things by two months or three months till whenever it normalizes.

The thought process is for us to be able to utilize the capacity whenever we have it. We don't want to sit on idle capacity.

We can tweak it as per our requirements.

Got it. Finally, the Sanand one entirely will be available in FY28, right?

Because that would be available in December '27 or what will be the last quarter of '28, FY28? Right?

Is my understanding correct?

Sir, we have a lot of flexibility here because we have our own machinery division. We have a lot of flexibility as to which month, which quarter we need to invest looking at our utilization levels.

Our thought process overall is to generate 20% capacity every year and grow at 20%. Keeping at a good utilization level.

Got it, all is fine. That's all from my side.

Thanks a lot. All the best.

Thank you.

Thank you for the opportunity, sir. You mentioned that the total capacity is now at 6,80,000 metric tonnes.

Would you be able to mention what is the split between high-carbon, low-carbon, and stainless steel? Also, what were the capacity utilization on those in FY26?

Sir, our general split in terms of capacity or in terms of utilization is generally MS, which remains within a range of 55 to 60%; high-carbon, which remains in the range of 25%, maybe 20 or 30 here in average 25%; and stainless steel at about 20%. Specialty is right now less than 3-4%.

Overall, we were at 67% Overall, we were at 67% capacity utilization.

Okay. Fair enough, that helps.

The capacity that is coming up now at Dadri of 1.2 lakh, even that will be split in the same ratios?

Yes, broadly that will be the ratio in which it would be.

Fair enough. Thank you, that's it from our side.

first of all, thanks for the opportunity. I might be new to the company, the question might be repetitive, please spare me for this.

My first question pertains to the steel cord. If I map down the industry size, industry size is roughly around 2.5.

If we expect a growth rate of 11% as well, that industry could grow at 4 lakh tonnes, right? In that space, first, Bekaert has already been planning to expand.

Second, Chinese is also been expanding into Thailand and then they are trying to supply from that. How we are looking at the scenario and are we still planning to go ahead with a 2 lakh tonnes of capacity in this steel cord?

Sure. You are definitely right on all these assumptions.

Of course, we are planning to go ahead with this capacity. That's the main focus area for all of us in the company.

Because there is only one company in India today making this. We are the only and the first Indian company to start it.

Therefore, we see a good traction in this product. From all calculations that we've done so far, even the pricing looks okay, the assumption that we've made still stand correct.

There is also a duty whenever there is an import. We also have a 10% arbitrage when we look at import prices.

It is a good business as of now. All our calculations support it.

This is the plan. Once we get our approvals, our definite goal is still 2 lakh tonnes of steel cord.

Okay. Sir, my second question is related to the same.

If we look at the total let's suppose in FY31, when we conclude with our 2 lakh tonnes of capacity, we might spend around 2 2,500 crores. In that thing, if we broadly calculate, we get a revenue of roughly around 2,500 to 2,700, in which if we calculate the margin of 25%, that makes a rough calculation of a 600 crores, right?

In that 600 crores, our payback should be around 5 to 6 years. Is that assumption correct or am I calculating something wrong?

You're absolutely right. However, because it will be spent in the next 5 to 7 years, we've taken a ballpark range of 2,000 to 2,500 crores of total investment for 2 lakh tonnes.

EBITDA as of now will range between 600 to 800 crores.

Got it. Got it, sir.

Sir, just want to understand what gives us so much confidence when we have been investing because then the total pie, if we look into it, we will be the largest catering to this segment. If let's suppose any competitor comes up, let's suppose example Tata Steel, if they comes up, they might not go with a small kind of investment.

They can also spend something large. What gives us confidence that we could be the market share leader and we will able to utilize our facility up and running at 100%?

Sure, sir. Sir, there are what we at least feel a lot of barrier to entry in this product.

Technology is one. To get the right people is another.

We already have about 60 trained people in this field, and it's not very easy to get the right set of people. Technology also, we have exclusive collaborations, exclusive tie-ups with our suppliers.

They are probably a very limited turnkey solution providers in this product. Third, there is a long approval process.

Right now, we're confident on this approval cycle and we've been able to manage it till now as well because there is nobody in the country. Once there is a supplier, it will go back to a lengthier approval process.

Lastly, I would say is also our style of investments, because we have our own machinery division, because we have been in this industry for about 85 years, and we have this diversification into a lot of different products. We are also able to keep our capex per tonne very low, which is the same case in steel cord as well.

The industry norm for this would be at least 50% higher than what we are looking at, and which is what we've already done in the first 20,000 tonnes.

Okay. Sir, just want to get some sense on the approval side.

Let's suppose example if a tire company approaches you or we approaches a tire manufacturer, just to understand, they will start manufacturing our steel cord applicability with a new product they have been launching, right? If they have launched 10 products before the approval, they might be continuing with the company which they have already approved or they've been approve let's suppose example Bekaert.

If they had approved a Bekaert, then they will continue with the process. The new product launches will start with us.

That's the assumption correct or they also replace the older models as well with wire cords?

The main consumption will happen in the existing models. In fact, in the newer models, they would choose to go with existing established players first and then approve us.

What our market would be will be the regular tires, will be the regular products that they make today. That is where we are taking the chunk.

Okay. Why do they shift?

Obviously the reason would be, but on the overall cost side, they might have a 5 to 7% of the total cost in their the manufacturing cost. Why do they shift specifically to us in the going model or the model which is up and running?

What would be the key reason? It might be obviously 1%, 2% cost saving could be there, and second the new product launches that have much more acceptability of our steel cord versus theirs.

Is that how works or it is very different than what I am assuming?

No, you are right. Other than that, I think it is also a security of supply chain.

Today, they're not able to buy anything from India. Everyone has to import.

I think in the last 5-7 years, we've all seen how disruptions happen if you are dependent majorly on imports. I think that is one big factor.

Steel cord as a percentage of their total cost is not a big number, but it is everything to make a tire. This is a very important product, and everyone I assume and I feel that all customers would be happy to get an Indian source.

This is our assumption with this product.

Got it, sir. Got it.

Continuation with ISG and OSG, we have been kind of going to receive all the BIS I think approval from the authority. Are we on place?

Do we have receive or what's the current status? Hello?

Hello?

Yeah. Sorry, I'm not able to understand your question.

Maybe we can take this later.

Okay. Done.

Thank you, thank you.

Yeah. Hi, sir.

Thank you for the opportunity. Am I audible?

Yes, sir. Yeah.

Pranav, just wanted to understand, see, are we being more conservative due to the current issues and the geopolitical issues that lead to the volume growth guidance of 20%? As earlier, I guess we used to grow at 30% plus, and even though we had guided 30% to 35%, right, in the previous calls?

Just to understand your thought on the guidance and going forward, even if you can throw some light for FY27 FY28 or so.

Sir, as a company, even in the last 10 years, we've grown at 20%, not 30%. There has never been a 30% kind of an averaging that we've done.

Our estimate for 30% was only last year. That was because there was a lot of pent-up demand that we had because we were not able to have our capacity up and running quicker.

Therefore, we had a 30% estimate of quantities last year. Now that the situation is normal, I think the goal overall for the company is to grow at around 20-25% each year.

Some year could be a little less, some year could be a little more.

But

20% is the broad understanding.

You're talking about volume growth, right?

Volume growth, yes. Volume as well as EBITDA.

Volume as well as EBITDA.

The growth when we say growth, it is majorly our EBITDA growth.

Okay. Understood.

Just a follow-up that in the year of FY26, what was the capacity utilization, by the way?

We had? The capacity utilization for FY26 was 67%, 68-ish percent overall.

68%, okay. Okay.

For FY27, are we aiming to be at 80% or plus?

Sir, yes, I think 80-85% is where I get the best return ratios for my investment. Because every year we also need to invest for the 20% growth next year, we will see.

70% plus is what we should look at at least.

Okay. Pranav, another just a bookkeeping question.

In the previous call that you highlighted, most of the capex has been done, and hence the depreciation and the finance cost has been capitalized. We are going to see the bottom-line growth, going forward.

I just wanted to understand, even in this quarter, PAT was largely driven by the lower taxation, just taxation benefits and all. Can you please throw some light?

Is my reading correct?

Sir, majority of depreciation that we had to take, we have already done. Now, any increase in depreciation will happen only with increase in actual EBITDA levels also.

There is not going to be a disproportionate extra investment or extra depreciation or even interest that we should see in the long run. Our thought process is if, let's say, the EBITDA grows at 20%, our depreciation and interest should also grow around the same range, not higher, not very low.

Understood.

Hi. Thanks for the follow-up.

Just clarification for this 1.2 lakh tonnes that you're adding this year, the capex would be around 150 crores?

Yes, sir. Broad range that we want to remain is around 200, 150 to 200 crores every year.

Okay. To grow at 20%, obviously this 1.2 lakh number every year will also need to keep going up because the base will keep getting bigger.

As of now for the next 2-3 years, I think average 150 to 200 crore average, and then of course every year it should increase by 20% our investment if we are also growing at 20%.

Okay. After a point when you decide that you have to go into steel cords, then your volume growth may slow down because much of your capex will be going to low-volume steel cord business, which generates higher EBITDA and volume would be low?

Yeah.

Absolutely. That's why I am talking about investment and not just absolute volumes here.

Our thought process is more on investments. Now wherever we make investments, volume could be different.

Understood. Sir, you said that currently you'll be sending trial volumes to one of the tire customers.

Whenever the final order comes, when do you think in your assessment, when can we start doing 20 kilotonnes run rate in steel cords? Which month or which quarter onwards?

Is it 3-4 quarters away, more than a year away? How should we look at it?

Sir, although because of the fire, we definitely had a pushback of about 6 months, but because of this expedited approval also, we might see some numbers within this financial year.

Okay. Currently, are we selling hose wire from that facility or hose wire is still not being sold?

No, we are selling hose wire from this facility. That is where we are trying to cover most of our main cost through selling hose wire.

Understood. This last question, when you said that the gas impact in terms of pricing per tonne or costing per tonne was around 4,000 to 5,000, the way to look at it is that if you were making ₹7,000 per tonne EBITDA, only for those 15 days, your EBITDA would have gone down to ₹2,000-₹3,000 per tonne.

Is my understanding correct?

Yes, but we also carry 10 to 15 days of inventory. Our inventory also held during that time.

It was not a complete hit that we had to take for the first 15 days.

Okay. Pricing has completely gone back to normal or have you been able to completely pass it on or there is still some hit in terms of EBITDA per tonne from gas as of now as well?

Sir, one good thing is that we have a very cost-plus business model, wherein we keep 30 to 40 days of inventory and 30 to 40 days of order book. Now this being a very exceptional increase, consumable is not something that we are able to take on previous orders.

Any orders that we booked after being impacted on our cost, we have taken our increase. Even today, the orders I'm booking are with an increased pricing, considering all this increase that has taken place.

For 30 to 40 days of order book, that order will somehow go at the old pricing, wherein we are taking that price hit.

No, that's fine. Fresh orders only I wanted to ask about.

Understood. Thanks a lot, Pranav.

Thank you.

Thanks for the opportunity, sir, again. Just continuing on previous participant question on the gas, just wanted to understand, what is the current scenario looking?

Are your suppliers asking for a higher price or what is the escalation in the prices? Can we get a broad understanding as far as gas prices are concerned?

Sir,

gas prices have still not returned to normal. They are still escalated.

In some areas, in some units, it is about 50%. In some units, it has gone up to 300% as well.

What would be the blended escalation for quarter one?

Blended, I would say, would be at least about 50%.

Is it a fair understanding to assume that for quarter one, for example, if your EBITDA per tonne was say about anywhere between 6,500 to 7,000, and just continuing on couple of other commentary, would it be possible or fair assumption that at least for the month of April, your EBITDA would be in the range of say about ₹1,500 to ₹2,500 or is that understanding way too low than what the current scenario is?

Sir, right now we are only in April. Right now we're only in the first month and we are seeing demand coming back.

I don't think the whole of the first quarter should go to that extent. I am sure we will see some recovery happening.

This 2, 2.5 thousand rupee a tonne level is only for the 30 to 40 days of order book. The whole quarter is not going to be that.

After that, it will return to normal.

Perfect.

Out of 90 days, I think at least 50 days of standard EBITDA we should get.

Perfect. That sounds good.

Sir, second question is on steel cord. Considering one of the large global brands is there in the market, supplying the material to the tire manufacturers for quite a few years, right?

How much discount or what would be the delta you need to incur to gain the market share? Just wanted to understand, to just push the volume, what is the kind of ASP reduction you need to consider compared to that particular MNC?

Sir, right now, I think it is still too early to judge the exact pricing level. As and when we move forward in this journey, I think we will come to that.

We do not expect a very big difference between us and anybody else, because right now, we are the first Indian company, we should get that advantage at least of not just being a new entrant not reducing price to a very large extent.

Perfect. That sounds good, sir.

Thank you, sir.

All right. Thank you.

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