BEML Limited

BEML Limited

1,907.70
INR
+19.40
(+1.03%)
7.96EPS
221.07P/E
146.62BMarket Cap
Nov 11Next Earn

Q1 FY2027 · Earnings Call TranscriptAugust 13, 2026

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the BEML Q1 FY27 earnings conference call. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes.

Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touchtone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded.

I now hand the conference over to Mr. Harshit Kapadia from Elara Securities.

Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Harshit Kapadia

Thank you, Steve. Good afternoon, everyone.

On behalf of Elara Securities, we welcome you all for the Q1 FY27 conference call of BEML Limited. I take this opportunity to welcome the management of BEML represented by Mr.

Shantanu Roy, Chairman and Managing Director; Mr. Anil Jerath, Director Finance; Mr.

Devi Prasad Satapathy, Director Human Resources; Mr. Sanjay Som, Director Mining and Construction; and Mr.

Rajeev Kumar Gupta, Rail and Metro; and Mr. Sanjay Dikade, Director Defence and Aerospace.

We will begin the call with a brief overview by the management followed by a Q&A session. I will now hand over the call to Shantanu sir for his opening remarks.

Over to you, sir.

Shantanu Roy

Hi, good afternoon. Are you able to hear me, Harshit?

Harshit Kapadia

Hello? Sir, we can hear you, sir.

Please go ahead.

Shantanu Roy

Good afternoon, all our investors. Thank you again for remaining invested.

The last quarter has been quite an improvement, probably the best first quarter we have had in the last decade or so with the top-line growth of 29%. This growth was led by a tremendous turnaround in the Rail and Metro segment, which grew by 178%, and mining was muted, it went down by 14%, mainly because some of the projects where we are already L1, the contract finalization has got deferred.

In defense overall we did a 25% improvement over the first quarter of the last financial year. The first time probably again we have hit a positive EBITDA ever, and the overall loss has gone down by almost 50%.

The overall working capital also has improved and the value-added per employee also has gone up by around 8%. I'm sure you already have worked out these numbers.

I need not repeat all this. We are currently sitting at an order book of around 16,000 crore, a little more than 16,000 crore.

We are looking at an opportunity size of 35,000 to 40,000 crores, mainly led by the metro and the rail, and of course defense. Mining as I talk to you, currently we are L1 in around 900 crore value of tenders, and we have a very healthy export order book currently at around $115 million, and we should end the year with an export order book of around $200 million.

Looking at the performance of the first quarter, I expect a similar or better growth in the second quarter and the quarters thereafter. Now we are ready to take any questions that you have.

Operator

Thank you, sir. We will now begin the question and answer session.

Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchtone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two.

Participants are requested to use handset while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles.

Our first question comes from the line of Varun Parekh with Shree Capital. Please go ahead.

Varun Parekh

Hi, good afternoon. Am I audible?

Shantanu Roy

Yes, sir, you are audible.

Varun Parekh

Yes, good afternoon once again and thanks for this opportunity. Congratulations on good set of numbers.

I have one simple question. Sir, basically, couple of years back, we had demerged surplus assets of our company into a different company.

Now, in the previous year, you have taken some 300 acres of Mysuru and some 36 acres of Bengaluru land back on lease from the same company. Can you please explain as to what is the rationale of that?

For what duration have we taken and what kind of plans do we have for that asset?

Shantanu Roy

As you rightly said, first, BEML Land Assets Limited was carved out as a fully owned subsidiary and some 3 years back, it was listed as a separate company. The land that we have decided to take on lease will be used for our production activities, some futuristic, some expansion activities as well.

For example, the land at Bangalore, we have already started utilizing for the current production of LHB coaches, of the high-speed train. Mysore, we'll be utilizing it more for aerospace.

Recently, we got an order just a couple of days back for the fuselage of light combat helicopter from HAL. We will be utilizing these land, which were lying unutilized basically.

Even though it is a part of BLAL, by paying a small lease rental, we'll be able to utilize that and produce the equipment and systems from these land and add to the sales revenue and the profitability of the company. Now, it's a 99-year lease currently, but it will be reviewed after 5 years or even before that depending on the next course of action that comes out of the current process of BLAL.

This being a BEML concall, it's not correct on my part to talk about what BLAL is going to do or BLAL's plans are, but this is the precise reason we decided that let us take this land on lease till at least we start our new production unit at Bhopal. Also at the same time, just a few days back, you might have read that Chhattisgarh, the cabinet has approved allocation of around 80 acres of land to us near Bilaspur in a place called Mungeli.

It's a very well located and nicely located land, which is around 70 km from Raipur and 50 km from Bilaspur. It lies somewhere in between.

It's adjoining the state highway and the nearest railhead is around 40 km. The development of these places will take some time, in the meantime, we'll be utilizing a land which is already available with BLAL and adjacent to us.

That is the thought. Once we get into more projects, for example, in aerospace, we are looking at the Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft where we'll be bidding shortly with our partners.

If that happens, then we'll be needing more space here. The Bilaspur plant will be used for our wheeled mining equipment: the trucks, the water sprinklers, motor graders and all.

The idea is that we should be near to our customer, our mining and mining equipment especially, 80% goes to Coal India and its subsidiaries. That is a place which is accessible to all the customers within 24 to 48 hours.

That is one of the reasons you might have heard earlier also, and we have shared that Bilaspur we are going to create a hub-and-spoke model. Already, the construction of the hub is almost ready.

That will be used as a central place for spare parts and for servicing all our customers from there rather than doing it from our units that are a few thousand kilometers away, more than a 1,000 km away from our customers.

Varun Parekh

Got it, sir. I think that's very helpful.

Just supplementary small follow-up on that. Basically, both these places, as you mentioned, will be utilized for the production purpose.

As you mentioned, Bengaluru, you have already initiated the production over there, and Mysuru, you are planning to start soon. What kind of capex will be involved at both these places for any understanding?

Shantanu Roy

Mysuru, we are yet to formulate the capex, whereas at Bangalore, the last month all our esteemed investors you were here, you have seen the production has already started. I think it's almost a month now, and in 1 month, we have made great progress.

The overall capex, I cannot say that for this particular tract of land, what is the exact capex. It may be hardly 3, 4 crores of capex, not more than that.

The overall capex that we have put in Aditya, it's in the range of around 250 crores. That is for the entire high-speed train complex.

Varun Parekh

Got it, sir. Thank you so very much and all the very best.

Shantanu Roy

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. Participants who wish to ask a question may press star and one.

The next question comes from the line of Prateek Dugar with IntelSense. Please go ahead.

Prateek Dugar

Hello, am I audible?

Shantanu Roy

Yes.

Prateek Dugar

Sir, actually, I wanted to ask about the Mumbai Railway Vikas Corporation tender. Has that tender been canceled or what is the situation?

Because it's been delayed for so long, sir.

Shantanu Roy

It has been canceled. That is what has come to us.

Prateek Dugar

Okay. Sir, just some days back, I heard you in an interview where you've talked about a 40,000 crore bidding pipeline.

Sir, as per our understanding, sir, MRVC itself was supposed to be 20,000. How come we are still expecting a 40,000 crore bidding pipeline?

If you could give that breakup of the pipeline, that would be great, sir.

Shantanu Roy

You are very right that 40,000 crore 40,000 crore had two components: one was MRVC, the other is the MEMU, which tend which which is which is still alive. Apart from that, we have some six tenders which are live for the metro.

The six tenders are Chennai Metro, Delhi Metro RS20, Delhi Metro RS21, UP Metro extension, Maha Metro that is Pune, Nagpur, and there is another one. No, Kochi will come, but just give me give me a sec.

MMRDA Line 12 where we have already bid. The ordering is yet to be done.

The six metro projects are there. Now, apart from that, it's a the market is very dynamic.

Currently, we are working on export opportunities for the metro sector. The export opportunity size is around 15,000 crores.

We are working in two export opportunities. I'll not be able to share with you the country, but it is around 15,000 crores.

Apart from that, we, as you all know, we already have submitted the bid for 16 train sets for the B28, that is the 280 km/h high-speed train project. Considering all this, overall 20,000 crore of order inflow, I'm talking only about the Rail and Metro, whatever opportunity we discussed, 20,000 crore is from the entire for the entire company from all the business verticals.

Now defense, we will have we are looking at a horizon we are we are looking at a number of around 4,000 to 5,000 crores, which is definitely going to come to us. Apart from that, mining construction, 900 crores we are L1.

We are bidding for another, 500 to 600 crores of tenders, and we are bidding for a big export opportunity from West Asia. I I hope the numbers tally, correct?

Prateek Dugar

Sir. Sir, can I get one more question?

It was regarding the HEMM, sir. NMDC has a big capex plan forward, and a large component of that is going to be the heavier moving machineries.

Are we getting any inquiries on that front, sir, for the HEMM?

Shantanu Roy

You see HEMM, we are already wherever there are opportunities for us, there we are bidding. It's not only NMDC, it's Singareni Collieries, it's Coal India and its subsidiaries.

Recently, this month itself, we got two orders from Coal India and its subsidiaries for some mining equipment. We also are looking at some export orders for the HEMM in the next 2 to 3 months, which is apart from the tender where we are going to participate shortly.

This opportunity that I am talking about from exports is from the Middle East, and it is apart from the tender that we are participating for in the West Asia.

Prateek Dugar

Sir, in the near to mid-term, anything on the Goliath crane or the cutter suction dredgers, on the marine side? Is there anything expected in the medium term?

Shantanu Roy

You see these are all developmental projects. Let me give you a picture.

Looking at tunnel boring machine, the design itself will take 1 year to 1.5 years followed by the development phase and the manufacturing, and it will take us at least 3 years to develop a tunnel boring machine. Before that, after which it will go for a bulk production.

As far as the Goliath crane is concerned, more than the Goliath crane, we are focusing on the STS, that is a ship-to-shore crane. Again, the entire cycle, the process cycle, it will take us at least 3 to 4 years.

I would say nothing in the short term, but yes, medium to long term. Medium term, I'm taking as 3 years, and long term is 5 to 6 years.

We can expect once the development happens and we go for the bulk production, something sizable will come in 3 to 5 years from these two segments.

Prateek Dugar

Sir, anything on the dredgers, sir? Cutter suction dredgers, we had done some tie-up we had done last time.

Shantanu Roy

Cutter suction, already we have submitted our offer for a few numbers of cutter suction dredgers, and we expect that the ordering will be done in the coming 2 to 3 months. It should be done.

Prateek Dugar

Sir. Thank you.

Thank you so much, sir.

Operator

Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Jyoti Gupta with Ashika Broking.

Please go ahead.

Jyoti Gupta

Good evening, sir, and thank you for the opportunity. One request, if you could put the quarterly presentation, whatever possible information that can be given, that will be great.

Second thing, I wanted to know we had flat margins in quarter 1. I just wanted to have an FY27 outlook in terms of revenue, what are you estimating revenue growth to be, EBITDA margins for the full year?

What about revaluation reserves? Last quarter, we had a major quarter 4.

Do you still think there could be some impact of that, because a lot of our exports are locked in? Could there be because of foreign currency fluctuations, will that impact these financials going forward?

Some light on that, please.

Shantanu Roy

Right. Yes, on a quarterly basis, we'll put up our presentation.

That we will do. Anyway, next time we have this, it will be I think a physical meeting with all our esteemed investors.

On the numbers, so as I mentioned, the first quarter was around 29% growth, and I expect a similar growth in every quarter. Overall CAGR should be for this year, it should be high 20s if all goes well.

It should go well because we have the executable orders now. All the orders that we had, it has reached the stage of bulk production.

For example, the LHB, the Vande Sleeper, we are going to complete shortly. The high speed also, we'll start delivering during this financial year.

The metro, Bangalore Metro has already yesterday we had the CRS inspection and very shortly, it will be put into commercial use. This year, we should expect at least 20, 25 trains for Bangalore.

Plus, we are already L1 in many of the tenders for HEMM, and defense there is a pipeline which is continuous. With that, this year, I'm quite bullish about the revenue.

As far as the EBITDA is concerned, 24-25, we did around 13, 13.3%. Last year, because of a one-off correction, it went down, but this year, my expectation is we'll again get back to at least 13% of EBITDA.

Your last question was regarding the impact that we had in the last quarter. Whatever impact was there, we have considered it.

This year, when we start realizing the sales, I think I have mentioned it in one of the discussions earlier as well, since these contracts are in foreign currency, one is a deemed export, when we took the contract and now when we are executing, the sales will be realized, there is at least a 50% to 60% improvement in exchange rate variation. My guess is that the losses that we have already booked, it will get mitigated to at least 20%, 25% in this financial year and maybe more in the coming years.

There will not be any impact, but there will be a positive impact once we start realizing the sales for the projects which are in foreign currency.

Jyoti Gupta

Great. One last question.

What is the development on the groundbreaking ceremony which happened in Bhopal? I think from that, you were expecting in 18 months, the plant would be commissioned and will start producing.

What's the status on that Bhopal project?

Shantanu Roy

You see 18 months from the start of the construction, right? Construction is yet to start.

We have already completed the boundary wall. We have tendered out the civil part, and we'll be finalizing it in, I think, next 2 to 3 months.

At the same time, we're working on arranging the debt finance for this project. The day the construction begins, after that, 18 months' time we will be able to roll out the first equipment, and the total time which will be required for completing this project will be around 24 months.

You see if I give you the example of Aditya, we did the groundbreaking on 1st September, and 25th of April, the plant was inaugurated. It was ready.

Bhopal will be done much faster than that.

Jyoti Gupta

Great. Sir, could you also give me the segment-wise breakup of revenue?

We have seen that at the consolidated level, I believe defense was 35%, Rail and Metro 24%, Mining and Construction 41%. Does that stand corrected, or correct me if my numbers are slightly skewed?

Shantanu Roy

I think your numbers are correct. I can only give you the growth vertical-wise.

Rail and Metro has grown by 178%, defense has grown by 25%, and Mining and Construction, that is the HEMM segment, has gone down by 14%.

Jyoti Gupta

Is the proportion likely to remain

Operator

I'm sorry to interrupt, Jyoti ma'am, can you please come back in the queue for further questions?

Jyoti Gupta

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Basantkumar Govindlal Bansal with NBG Investments.

Please go ahead.

Basantkumar Govindlal Bansal

Yeah. Good afternoon, sir.

My question was on the segmental breakup of the revenue, which my previous participant has asked. May I make a one request that why don't you recognize these three segments as a segment and report them as a segment under segment reporting?

That will be very helpful in terms of revenue and the margin. Second question is how do you see this mix 5 years down the line?

Shantanu Roy

We are exempted from segmental reporting. That is number one.

Number two, I'll be happy if instead of these three verticals, they are hived off as three separate companies and BEML becomes a holding company, then it becomes easier for us. Right?

I hope you will agree. On mix 5 years down the line, already the trend is there from this year itself, from 25-26 itself.

HEMM average contribution to top line has been 45%, highest was 2016-17 when it contributed 61% to the top line, and 25-26 it went down to 40%. The contribution from defense and rail metro was 60%.

The trend will continue and the trend should be, in my opinion, and it is also evident from the order book opportunities and our aspiration to grow, it should be around 65% to 70% Rail, Metro, and Defense, and 30% HEMM. Currently, 65% is Rail, Metro only.

I think that tells the story.

Basantkumar Govindlal Bansal

Can this defense go up to 50% or more?

Shantanu Roy

No, I don't want to speculate, but as of now, I don't feel like that. It's better that we talk about Rail and Metro and Defense together.

It will be around 65% to 70%. In that, defense may go up to 50%, rail may go down to 20%, but I don't see that possibility immediately looking at the opportunity size in rail.

Basantkumar Govindlal Bansal

Yeah. Sir, one last thing from my side that which verticals has a high-margin potential?

Shantanu Roy

Sir, all verticals have a high-margin potential. Again, if you look at the biggest margin contributors, it is number one, the sustenance, that is the spare parts and services.

The second highest contributor to margin is exports.

Basantkumar Govindlal Bansal

Okay. Okay.

Not in terms of defense, railway or mining construction?

Shantanu Roy

It is applicable for all. Sustenance has the highest margin and exports follows it very closely.

Sir. Okay.

Basantkumar Govindlal Bansal

Okay. Thank you.

I think this is very helpful.

Operator

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, if you wish to ask a question, you may press star and one.

The next question comes from the line of Sagar Gandhi with Invesco Mutual Fund. Please go ahead.

Sagar Gandhi

Good afternoon, sir. Am I audible?

Shantanu Roy

Yes, yes. Good afternoon.

You're very much audible.

Sagar Gandhi

Thank you so much, sir. Sir, if you can highlight the size of the opportunity that we can capitalize on specifically from the high-speed rail project, which is the Mumbai-Ahmedabad bullet train project, if my understanding is correct, you are the prime rolling stock manufacturer for this program.

Given that government has very keen to operationalize this project over the next 1 year or so, how large an opportunity it can open for us?

Shantanu Roy

You see the Mumbai-Ahmedabad corridor already the number of trains is fixed. We are mandated to build two trains of 280 km/h, and after that, what is in the public domain is we have submitted an offer for 16 trains.

Now when it happens, how much it happens, only time will tell. Yes, once we deliver these two trains and they undergo all the tests and all, it will open up a huge opportunity for us for the upcoming seven corridors.

In my opinion, the upcoming seven corridors will require at least 600 trains, and 600 trains, it can open up around 50% of that market for us because I don't think one single company will be able to cater to these many number of trains. There will be two companies at least will be supplying rolling stock for the forthcoming high-speed train projects.

It is in the next 10 years. It's a 10-year pipeline, 10 to 10 to 15-year pipeline.

It's a huge opportunity. It's not only about the domestic seven high-speed train corridors, but it also opens up the export market.

Wherever there is a high-speed train requirement, at least we can tie up with somebody and India as a country and BEML as a company will be at a different level. That is the biggest gain from the rolling stock being manufactured, designed, developed, everything done here in the country.

Sagar Gandhi

Perfect, sir. On the two train sets which you are already building, the prototype one, it is in the what you call execution stage?

Is it done? Is it certified?

Where is it exactly?

Shantanu Roy

How it can be certified so quickly? We have just started the production.

I guess you were not there when with the other esteemed investors who visited. We started the production sometime in April, and when our investors visited in June, July, we had started building some modules and all.

Now we have reached the level of the complete shell, the car body shell we call it, right? We have reached that stage.

Since it's a clean sheet design, every stage has a lot of checks, balances, design validation, then some tests are to be carried out, and once we deliver the train, which we expect 4 to 5 months from now, maybe 5 months from now, the first train, then it has to undergo extensive testing at depot and the main line. Before the train goes out from our factory, it will also undergo extensive test at the car level, at the basic unit level.

Basic unit is four cars make one basic unit and the complete rake level or the train level. Only after this testing is done, next year by this time, the testing should be over.

Then only we can say that yes. It is too early in the day, but we are quite confident we are on the right path.

Sagar Gandhi

Thank you so much, sir. Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. Participants who wish to ask a question may press star and one.

The next question comes from the line of Amit Anwani with PL Capital. Please go ahead.

Amit Anwani

Hi, sir. Good afternoon.

Shantanu Roy

Good afternoon.

Amit Anwani

Sir, my first question again a follow-up on high-speed rail. We said that probably by next year, we'll be done with the testing.

Just wanted to understand what is the kind of per-coach cost of production and what is our scope in that? Once the testing is done, if I take probably just 2, 3 years view, any expectations on what kind of HSR order which can come to you?

You highlighted the long pipeline, but anything in near term we expect that probably can come since there are a lot of corridors and DPRs are getting prepared. Anything on that would help.

Shantanu Roy

I just mentioned that for the Mumbai-Ahmedabad corridor, we have submitted our offer for 16 train sets and decision will be taken based on which, we'll execute further trains. As far as the other corridors are concerned, it is too early for me to speculate also, right?

It will be speculation and it will be wild speculation. What is important is that we will be ready.

We will be ready for that. We have already started working on the 350 km/h, that is the next level that I expect the new corridors to be.

As far as the cost of production is concerned, you see it's a development stage and once the train is manufactured, it is tested, then probably I will be able to comment on the cost of production. As to how much it is ours, it is 100% ours.

It is 100% Indian, including the IP. The intellectual property is Indian intellectual property and it is 100% ours.

Amit Anwani

Right. Even the propulsion systems are locally sourced than all other things?

Shantanu Roy

Propulsion is locally sourced, sir.

Amit Anwani

Understood. Second ballpark probably compared to 180 km/h trains like Vande Bharat, it will be 1.5x or 2x kind of a costing for this HSR?

Shantanu Roy

It will not be correct on my part to give you a ballpark figure because it is not that 160 km/h is X, 280 km/h will be 280 - 160 divided by something some percentage that much X. It does not work like that.

It is exponential basically. As the speed goes up, it is exponential.

Amit Anwani

Right. Understood.

Second question, sir, on the capex, what's the capex outlined? You have highlighted probably we're increasing capacities on the Rail and Metro side.

On the capex segment-wise, what's the capex expectations this year and next year? For the Rail and Metro, I think we were talking about taking the numbers from some 250 units, the capacity was supposed to go to 350, 400.

Any change in that number since we are now also preparing for HSR over next 3, 4 years? This is the question.

Shantanu Roy

No, there is no change in those numbers. In fact, once Aditya is since Aditya is fully operational now, first we will focus on HSR and then we will shift, we'll we'll go for the bulk production also of the HSR as and when when it comes.

We are also utilizing HSR facilities which are available for our other projects as well. As far as the capex is concerned, I just mentioned Aditya, we have infused around 250 crores of capex.

The overall capex plan, the last year, last year capex spent was around 379 crore, which was the highest, probably in the last 15 years, 20 years, I don't know, we have to we have to check that data. This year, we have planned around 600 crores plus once Brahma starts, so that will be another around 900 crores or so, but it will not happen this year.

The the spending will go into the next year and maybe year after that, it will be spread spread over. Plus, the the new unit at Chhattisgarh, the land has recently been allocated to us.

It's a it's a very good tract of land and very apt for a heavy earthmoving machinery. There we are working out the capex and maybe in the next 3 to 4 months, we'll work out what kind of capex we would like to infuse there.

That in that essentially will be the total capex plan for the next 4 years or so, 4 4 to 5 years, I guess.

Amit Anwani

Right. Sir, lastly, if you could share the order balance breakup segment-wise as of today and full-year order inflow expectation this year.

Shantanu Roy

The order availability 65% is the order from Rail, 25% from Defense, 4% from Mining, 6% from Exports currently. This year, the order infusion of 1,180 till now, Defense has given us 50%, Mining has given us around 25%, and around 35% has come from the exports.

The overall order inflow this year, again, my expectation is 65% to 70% will come from Rail and Metro, and some 20-odd percent should come from Defense, and around 5% from international business and mining another 5% to 6%, but mining whatever comes, it goes out also. That is how it will be.

Amit Anwani

Right. What's the kind of absolute number for order inflow this year expectations?

Shantanu Roy

Order inflow expectation is 20,000 crore, sir. We will try for 20,000 crore.

We expect that with around 30%, 40% probability, we should have around 20,000 crores of orders.

Amit Anwani

Understood, sir. Thank you so much, sir.

All the best.

Shantanu Roy

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Sachin Maniar with 3P Investment Managers.

Please go ahead.

Sachin Maniar

Hello. Hi, good afternoon, sir.

Can you hear me?

Shantanu Roy

Yeah. Good afternoon.

Sachin Maniar

Yeah. Hi, sir.

On the recent order from HAL for light combat helicopter for the fuselage, can you help me what this is for how many numbers? Because what we understand that HAL is making almost 156 numbers over 4, 5 years.

Would we expect repeat orders from the same?

Shantanu Roy

Repeat order, I don't think so, but let us see. It is 60% of the total 156 numbers that we have received, right?

Sachin Maniar

It's

Shantanu Roy

around 90, 92 numbers and I'm sure you know the fuselage is the complete shell, basically, the helicopter shell.

Sachin Maniar

Correct? Okay.

Okay. Okay.

This would be spread out over 4, 5 years, right, this order would be?

Shantanu Roy

I think 3 years. The exact quantity is 48 numbers.

Sachin Maniar

Okay. 48 numbers.

Sure. Sir, second question, if you can help me what would be the R&D expected this year?

Last year, you have increased your spending to 251 crores. How are you looking for this year?

Shantanu Roy

In terms of the percentage of the top line, it should be around 7%. If we do a 25% growth, then it should be something more than 300, 300 crores.

Sachin Maniar

Sure. Sure.

Sure. Thank you.

Thanks. That's it from my side.

Thank you, sir.

Shantanu Roy

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Basantkumar with NBG Investments.

Please go ahead. Yeah.

Basantkumar Govindlal Bansal

Sir, I have two questions. One is from macro perspective that what are the concern and challenges that keeps you worried?

Shantanu Roy

The concern and challenges that keeps me worried is how to maximize our shareholder wealth.

Basantkumar Govindlal Bansal

From business perspective.

Shantanu Roy

From result perspective is

Basantkumar Govindlal Bansal

No, no, from business perspective.

Shantanu Roy

Business perspective is number one, to grow consistently with a CAGR of 20%; number two, to have a healthy EBITDA margin of at least 17% to 18%; and number three, to reduce the working capital, to reduce our debtors, to reduce our inventory. These are the three major challenges.

Once we do that, then obviously our operating ratios, these inventory ratios and efficiency ratios, all this will be all right. It will enhance the shareholder wealth and add more value.

Basantkumar Govindlal Bansal

Second question was about working capital, and as you rightly said, this is one of your concern areas. What steps you are taking to improve the working capital cycle?

What can help you to improve it?

Shantanu Roy

You see working capital has got two components: one is the inventory, the other is the debtor. One of the major reason for the debtor has been, if you look at our revenue spread quarter-to-quarter, it is generally 10% first quarter, 20% second, 30% third quarter, 40% fourth quarter.

In fact, last year, the fourth quarter was almost 45%. When it when so much revenue skewed in the last quarter, then the debtor goes up substantially, correct?

Also the inventory, it it also keeps piling up till till the end we we carry inventory so that, in the last quarter we can make some sales. Two things we have targeted and this year probably it will help us.

We should start the year with a healthy executable order pipeline, which when I say executable, it is ready for bulk production. Fortunately, this year we opened like that and the main idea is to have a sustainable pipeline.

Next year also, we should open like that. Once we do that, by second quarter, if we are able to do even 35% of the total revenue planned, it will help us a help us in a big way.

If if we are able to do around 70% also by the third quarter, in the final quarter, we'll be left with only 30%, correct? It will help in bringing the debtors under control to a great extent.

It will help in keeping the inventory also under control, inventory consisting of raw material, semi-finished goods, finished goods. These are the steps we are taking with the tighter inventory control management, more focused approach, planning the inventory in such a way that, the long-lead items, it should be available with us, at the same time, increasing our value of production.

The value of production enhancement goes a long way in improving our margins. These are the steps we are taking.

Basantkumar Govindlal Bansal

Sir. Okay.

Understood. This is very helpful.

Operator

Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Rakesh Roy with Boring AMC.

Please go ahead. Hi,

Rakesh Roy

sir. My first question regarding sir, can you light on the your sir program on marine engine?

Shantanu Roy

Marine engine, we are not doing anything currently. We are exploring, but nothing concrete has happened till now.

We are focusing on the land system engines for the defense applications. Here we are working out, we are exploring various partners, what type is needed.

Currently, we don't have any concrete marine engine.

Rakesh Roy

Okay. Sir, my next question sir, as you mentioned here you have looking to 5 to 6 4 to 5,000 order inflow in defense segment.

This include sir after Pinaka or QRSAM order will come, this include this one also, supporting vessel? No,

Shantanu Roy

no, Pinaka we have not considered. QRSAM we have not considered.

We have some orders in the pipeline: one is the ARV, WZT, already you are all aware that DAC has cleared 230 numbers. Then we have a command post vehicle.

Then we have self-propelled carrier. Then we have some tank transporters.

Then light armoured multipurpose vehicle where we fielded the vehicle, it has successfully cleared the winter trials. Now it will go for summer trials.

These are

Rakesh Roy

Hello? Yeah.

Shantanu Roy

that we are expecting.

Rakesh Roy

Hello?

Shantanu Roy

Yes.

Rakesh Roy

Yeah. Sir, my question is sir simple, sir, after sir QRSAM because Bharat Dynamics or BEL is expecting this year already for near about 30,000.

To Bharat Dynamics for QRSAM, how much order will come to BEML for supporting vessel?

Shantanu Roy

Something in the range of 600, 600 crores, 600 to 700 crores.

Rakesh Roy

This is for a regiment or for full?

Shantanu Roy

No, it is for full.

Rakesh Roy

Okay. Okay.

Right, sir. Right, sir.

Right, sir. Thank you, sir.

Operator

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question for today.

I now hand the conference over to Mr. Harshit Kapadia for closing comments.

Harshit Kapadia

Thanks, Steve. We would like to thank the management of BEML for giving us this opportunity to host this call.

We would also like to thank all investors and analysts for joining this call. Any closing remarks, Shantanu sir, you want to share with investors?

Shantanu Roy

No, I think we are very lucky to have such learned investors who have continued investing in the company and very, very interesting questions, very interesting queries. My only request is that remain invested in the company, and we'll try to create as much value as we can for all our investors, for all our shareholders.

Thank you very much.

Operator

Thank you. On behalf of BEML, that concludes this conference.

Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines. Thank you.